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War objectors excluded from contracts in Iraq

Chris

Well-Known TRIBEr
I would say Canada has had more than its far share of Defence contracts from the States wouldn't you. Didn't you post something about that up not too long ago?

But I'm with you, not surprising

I still cant believe I was duped into believing that this country must have WMD hidden. There is no way they (US) would lie to the world community in their efforts to drum up support to invade. I still cant believe I feel for it.
 

JMan

TRIBE Member
^^^^

The more you peel the rhetoric onion, the stinkier it all gets. But the control mechanisms have worked effectively up until recently, so don't feel too bad.

J
 

Syntax Error

Well-Known TRIBEr
France, for its part, said it would examine the legality of the American decision.
and if it is illegal? what the hell are they going to do? the us obviously doesn't give a shit about what the international community thinks, see the war for an example.
 

man_slut

TRIBE Member
Well one thing is for sure. The Iraqi "insurgents" won't have a difficult time blowing up contractors who supported the war.
 
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Boss Hog

TRIBE Member
Even before the war in Iraq began March 20, the Bush administration was considering plans to help rebuild the country after fighting ceased. According to news reports in early March, the U.S. Agency for International Development secretly asked six U.S. companies to submit bids for a $900 million government contract to repair and reconstruct water systems, roads, bridges, schools and hospitals in Iraq.

The six companies -- Bechtel Group Inc., Fluor Corp., Halliburton Co. subsidiary Kellogg, Brown & Root, Louis Berger Group Inc., Parsons Corp. and Washington Group International Inc. -- contributed a combined $3.6 million in individual, PAC and soft money donations between 1999 and 2002, the Center reported on its news site, CapitalEye.org. Sixty-six percent of that total went to Republicans. opensecrets.org
It's a PR stunt. Trying to punish the non-allied in the public spotlight as a means of humiliating and teaching a lesson to those that don't fall in line with the US's policy of global reorganization.

Halliburton (Cheney) and Bechtel (Rumsfeld) already have their contracts in place. What does Bush get? Campaign dollars.

Halliburton:
Separately, Halliburton reported Wednesday that its third-quarter revenue rose to $4.14 billion from $2.98 billion a year earlier, in part because of KBR's government work. Of this we're already starting to see them milk it for all it's worth.

Bechtel:
Faced with escalating costs and continued instability in Iraq, U.S. officials in Baghdad have decided to boost Bechtel Group Inc.'s postwar reconstruction contract by $350 million, or more than 50%, The Wall Street Journal reported Thursday.


So let's get this straight - Halliburton and Bechtel are taken care of first off, no bidding, we've taken care of some of our election dollar donations and our buddies, and the rest is a carrot we'll wave in the face of everyone who didn't back us. That should be a lesson to them, and a message to the world. It's a public relations game they play, failing to see that they might be wrong but wallowing in the hubris of self-righteousness.

There might be more to say when we see who gets the 18 billion and how it's actually spent. Not to mention the money they spend when they (inevitably) go over budget.

For all the money Halliburton and Bechtel have gotten, what has happened in Iraq? Bush says all kinds of great things are happening despite daily attacks on US troops. Just like he told us there'd be a ton of WMD's. How can you make progress in a country that simply does not want you there, or governing over them?

Yes, there are people among us who believe that the US is yet to turn Iraq into utopia, however, there is still the example of Afghanistan, a job of "liberation" not even quarter finished before the US trounced on Iraq. Where's the commitment? Now there's talk of Syria, Iran, Korea, Cuba... how much will they accomplish with dwindling resources in Iraq when Bush is so attack-happy, wants to build weapons in space at the same time AND has the idea of sending a mission to the moon. The man is delusional. To think he or his administration has the ability to deliver any country from "terror" is both presumptuous and foolish, and we've seen that his method of combatting terror does not work, but rather breeds it.

So this 18 billion dollars for contracts - so? It's blood money. Let them wave their bloody carrot, I'm glad Canada doesn't take any of the money. There are far better ways to make money on this planet than by destroying countries then paying yourself (or other minions) to rebuild them.

I'm also interested in hearing what the other "hippies" on here have to say.
 
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Subsonic Chronic

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by JMan
The more you peel the rhetoric onion, the stinkier it all gets.
haha... nice one!

Globe and Mail - Paul Martin's reply

Deputy Prime Minister John Manley
"To exclude Canadians just because they are Canadians would be unacceptable if they accept funds from Canadian taxpayers for the reconstruction of Iraq,"
It's important to point out that Canada is contributing somewhere between $250 and $300 million to the reconstruction of Iraq.

Bush is saying that he'll take our money, but won't let our companies participate in the bidding process, because we didn't follow them like pussy-ass lapdogs when they broke international law and invaded Iraq based on some trumped up bullshit about imaginary weapons.

Fuck that.
 

Subsonic Chronic

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by Boss Hog
It's a PR stunt.
Exactly. He's already handed over the lion's share of the contracts to his industry pals, and now is rubbing the rest in the face of everyone who didn't participate in his illegal war.

Hey... did anyone else read how that Turkey that Bush was shown with on his Iraq Thanksgiving trip was a fake? It was a prop for his photos. Now raise your hand if you're not all that surprised.
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
The money we offered to reconstruct Iraq was humanitarian in nature. Binding it to contracts for work is wrong in my opinion. Either you give the money to solve a situation or you give it as a bribe to get industrial contracts, I would preffer option A myself.


(besides we still get the same economic benifit, all of the compaines are publicly listed we can buy stock in them accordingly)
 
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oddmyth

TRIBE Member
I read this in the NYtimes, there was no mention of Canada on the barred list, just France, Germany and Russia. As well there are no stipulations to say that these countries are barred from being subcontracted for these 18 projects.

In the NYtimes article a spokesman from Germany stated that Germany is already involved in many subcontracts.

There are also over 61 countries bidding for these contracts.

Can someone find a link to an article that has the list? I would really like to see if Canada is indeed on it.

EDIT: Found the report from Wolfowtiz
http://rebuilding-iraq.net/pdf/D_F.pdf

Ditto -> so you give the money to whom? And what do they do with it? How do they work out competitive contract bidding? The US has setup a set of standards to do so. How is this a bribe for industrial contracts? How else would anyone go about competitive bidding for contracts on a worldwide scale (this ensures most dollar value for their capital investment in Iraq).

PRIMAL -> do you have any substantiation for such remarks? Or do we just speak without cause?

odbx
 

Lurker

TRIBE Member
ChrisD, you are totally correct when saying we have a lot of defense contracts. But my point is to openly exclude other countries (not just ours) from getting infrastucture contracts withing Iraq itself is no good.

should be interesting to watch how quickly the US tries to get out of this situation without actually finishing what it started.

Paul
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by oddmyth


Ditto -> so you give the money to whom? And what do they do with it? How do they work out competitive contract bidding? The US has setup a set of standards to do so. How is this a bribe for industrial contracts? How else would anyone go about competitive bidding for contracts on a worldwide scale (this ensures most dollar value for their capital investment in Iraq).

No I'm saying we can't use our donation to reconstruction as a bribe for these contracts. If we gave the money regardless of the sumber of canadian companies given the contracts we gave the money.
 
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mingster

TRIBE Member
who the fuck gave the US ownership of iraq and everything that goes on there?


god, this is infuriating.

can anyone give me some insight on the situation with the UN? can they step in and take over? would they want to? or are they letting the states clean up their own mess? how does this work?
 

Evil Dynovac

TRIBE Member
The UN is a voting forum for countries that have joined. They make policy but have absolutely no means to back it up. The UN can and will do nothing because it means individual countries standing up against the US.

None of them are capable of doing it.

This whole Iraq thing is a simple matter of imperialism. We are shocked because the US hasn't been this blatent for some time now.
 
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mingster

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by Evil Dynovac
The UN is a voting forum for countries that have joined. They make policy but have absolutely no means to back it up. The UN can and will do nothing because it means individual countries standing up against the US.

None of them are capable of doing it.

This whole Iraq thing is a simple matter of imperialism. We are shocked because the US hasn't been this blatent for some time now.

well, that's just fucking crazy.
 

Subsonic Chronic

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by mingster
who the fuck gave the US ownership of iraq and everything that goes on there?
Yeah... didn't they "liberate" Iraq? And didn't we see Bush on an aircraft carrier with a banner in the backround reading 'Mission Accomplished' meaning that the liberation has been completed?

How fucking liberated do the Iraqis have to be, before they can make decisions affecting their own country?
 
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