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The Unpopular Non-Breeders thread

basketballjones

TRIBE Member
It's not that I look down on breeders so much as I don't trust them. What kind of person willingly subjects themselves to that much hard work and pain for nothing more than a hand-crafted greeting card that opens backwards and contains a sentiment that is spelled incorrectly such that it has no discernible meaning to anyone except the sender (and maybe not even them, who knows) and then perhaps a pasta necklace that you can't really wear anywhere (if you're lucky) on mother's day?

A crazy person.



PS. I'm totally joking, usually all of the time :p
bwahahahahahhahahah
 

Dirty Girl

TRIBE Member
I always wanted kids, was just waiting to meet the right guy and all the get married, kids happy ending stuff!

Then I got diagnosed with cancer at 32, and from my stem cell transplant I am menopausal (at 34). Now I am in remission and I am soon turning 35 and we are getting some pressure that if we are going to have a kid it has to be now! but I don't know if I can handle the no sleep part, I sleep like 10 hours every night (sorta related to my illness).

We did fertililty preservation which is an IVF procedure but you freeze the eggs before my stem cell trannsplant (stem cell is the new form of bone marrow transplant following high doses of chemo)

My husband says he is fine either way.

I think along the same lines as Metal Morphosis....I love being around my family and having a family. down the road if it was just us it would be kind of sad waking up Christmas morning etc.

I think we might try and have an only child... I was always against just having one, since only child kids are kind of weird and always need adult attention, but that is where cousins can help.

Also we would have to do fertility treatment and there is no guarantee, so what ever happens kids / no kids we will be making the choice, no happy surprises making the decision for us!
personally I think being an only child sucks. it especially sucks when your parents get older and start going downhill, and you are the only one there and all the responsibility for their welfare is solely on your head. I swore I would never have an only child.

and since I think being an only child sucks I always planned on having this gigantic house and being a foster parent and having like 12 kids.
I was gonna adopt a bunch, nab homeless kids off the street, and make this really great big happy family for everyone.
unfortunately I cant even afford a wendy house nevermind a gigantic house big enough to fit 12 kids. I saw this job ad for someone to live in a kids home type house thing, I completely flipped and was like OMG I WANNA DO THAT. but you needed a degree in social work or some shit. :(

I'd still like to adopt kids or be a foster parent tho, I think there are enough kids in this world that need love. I dont think I would feel any different to a child I'd adopted than I would to one I gave birth too. the only reason I actually want to have a kid of my own is cause Im curious to see what it comes out looking like. other than that I could care less about actually giving birth, all seems pretty gross if you ask me.

either way i guess im having nothing- the eggs are drying up, I have no penis to have kids with and wont have one anytime soon, in a few short years I will be too old, and I dont have enough money etc to get approved for fostering or adopting and probably never will, nor am I willing to bring a child into the world when I dont think I will be able to take care of them financially the way I would like. so i guess im fuckered, which is too bad cause i'd be an awesome mum. cest la vie.
 
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Maui

TRIBE Member
The age when everyone has kids, and I guess when biologically you need to do it before your ovaries fuck out comes around at the WORST time for your career.

I mean, you finally start getting where you need to be and then you have to take a year off to have a kid? It's kind of unfair.

I dunno. I'm not ready now. I'm 30 and I have so much to get done to be where I want to be in the next few years. I also still have so much travelling to do.

I need more time. I wish 40 was a viable age to start doing this shit. I can't handle it now.
Uhhh I'm no expert on having kids but my sister who is 39 just had her first kid and is planning to wait a couple years before having her second.
 

rubytuesday

TRIBE Member
Uhhh I'm no expert on having kids but my sister who is 39 just had her first kid and is planning to wait a couple years before having her second.
More women are waiting until they are older to have babies for the reasons ila mentioned and it doesn't always work out as hoped, that's great that your sister was able to have a baby though.

Sometimes it seems like the best thing would be to have your babies young, then finish your education slowly while raising your babies, and aim to be in the workforce by the time your kids are all out of diapers and in school. Then you could be working at full steam while your coworkers are still in the baby stage. This is not a likely scenario for most women though, the odds of being in a good place for that in your 20's are slim.

Anyway to the women on the fence, I don't know what to say. My process was I knew I wanted to have at least one baby in my life. Suitable partner felt the same. We weren't in the best place in our lives but we have supportive family (i.e. free childcare) and flexible if demanding schedules so we went for it. It's been hard at times but we've never resented our son, and we are very lucky that he's healthy and happy, I can't imagine how much harder things would be otherwise. I think working full-time in the early years is balls but that's subjective.

My partner kills me sometimes because he runs his own business so is always working but I've realized he gives so much more than some other partners do in terms of help and support even though his hours at home can be limited. You need to talk to your partner about expectations beforehand. I did not want to be a sole parent in a relationship. My partner does everything but breastfeed and shop for cloth diapers, it's not always 50-50 and I've resented him at times but especially as L gets older things get more balanced and easier. I know it was really hard for him to be up with a baby through the night and then work all day but he's got such a strong bond with L and I'm able to leave them together and that is huge for me.

Anyway I don't think everyone has to have babies but I think being realistic but not fearful of the possibilities is a good place to explore things from. In our society having a baby costs a lot of money if you don't have a lot of family support and if you have to pay for childcare. It will definitely cramp your style for at least a couple of years. It puts the focus of your life on someone other than yourself and your partner, and that can be hard on relationships. You might have a really easy baby and be able to travel and do everything with a baby on your hip but that's a best case scenario. Having a baby is a 'hope for the best plan for the worst' kinda thing. : )

Oh and I don't think it's a bad thing to have one child. If you take the money you would have spent on a second one and invest it so that your child won't be stuck supporting two parents when you're older that would be nice though. I think people downplay how negative sibling relationships can be, there are plenty of happy only children out there.
 
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grumblegirl

TRIBE Member
Oh and I don't think it's a bad thing to have one child. If you take the money you would have spent on a second one and invest it so that your child won't be stuck supporting two parents when you're older that would be nice though. I think people downplay how negative sibling relationships can be, there are plenty of happy only children out there.
Ruby, I like everything you said, but *especially* this ^.

My kid will likely be an only child, and he is good with other kids, on his own, with adults, whatever. I'm a single parent, so he's used to being ignored (benign neglect FTW!) I'd like him to have a sibling because I like the fact that I HAVE a sibling and it feels weird to me to think of NOT having one, but he's still well-adjusted and social and age-appropriate, without one.
 

Beer babe

TRIBE Member
As the starter of this thread, i have to say i may have changed my mind. I don't know what it is. I never wanted marriage or kids. But after my last relationship ended, it's like something changed. And what's frustrating is I'm 38...not a great time to be realizing this is what you really want.

*heavy sigh*
 

IgStar

TRIBE Member
tell me about it. almost 36 over here, was fully prepared to start trying with my BF...then this bullshit happened. :(

now what?
add to that I have a cyst (S) on my ovary, I have a US tomorrow.
watch..they're gonna tell me I can't have kids. LOL
bad luck runs in 3's....I've 2 happen already.

WATCH. oh I will laugh.(then cry)
 

Beer babe

TRIBE Member
Awww, sorry to hear you have to go through that on top of everything else, Iggy :( I hope everything ends up being ok. *hugs*

I'm with you on the 'where to go from here'. I have absolutely no idea right now.
 
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Dirty Girl

TRIBE Member
ew igs seriously? ew.
now I feel for being a bitch to you an hour ago. :(

well you have two ovaries, so even if one is busted you should still be able to have kids with the other one.
 

lucky1

TRIBE Member
I'm had many cysts, if it is "functional cyst" it is actually a good sign according to my doctor since it means you are ovulating
 

IgStar

TRIBE Member
yah, it could be nothing...who knows. It's just the way it all happened kinda concerned me. I miscarried a couple years back (that was the shining moment when I realized HOLY SHIT I DO WANT KIDS, which sucked. but I digress..) anyways...they didn't do the d&c properly, THANKS. so had to go back 2x for that ordeal, what a nightmare.

my periods were never the same after that. they got worse, more painful, etc etc...then my family dr. sent me for this same u/s last year b.c I was having a constant dull pain...I never heard back, so assumed it was AOK.
fast foward to this may when I have a new family dr (old one retired) and during my physical she saw something...she asks "Did Dr. X not tell you about these cysts you have?
me " um...no."
her " have you been having bad menstrual cycles?"
me "um...yes."

her" ok well I don't want to concern you, have you seen a gyno anytime at all or just Dr.X?"
me "just her, never seen a gyno"

so she said she wants a 2nd opinion, that she was suprised my old dr. never followed up with me.
I dunno, the whole thing was just unsettling. The fact that AFTER that miscarriage, I never got pregnant again, I can't say we were over the top careful...so I dunno. LOL I'm sure I'm just being all paranoid and dumb...it's just from my experience (and others I'm sure)..when it rains, it pours.
stay tuned. haha
 

wakipaki

TRIBE Member
I'm fine with breeders, some of my best friends are breeders. What can become annoying is when breeders only talk about pregnancy, birth, breast feeding, diaper changing, my kid's latest injury, my kid's latest classes, etc. Some people go though such a large change, they almost cease to have anything left of the person they were before. When the conversation is only about their child/ren, then I get annoyed.

I can understand that some of the conversation would be about the children - of course they're a huge part of that friend's life, but please don't tell me the details of every little decision you're making for your baby. I've had phone conversations with a friend who spends the whole time telling me about baby decisions (things that I can't even really offer advice on) and didn't once stop to ask about how I'm doing.

Its mostly women that do this though; the men seem largely immune.

i find a lot (but not all) of women are pretty much never the same after having kids, a solid career and back to work relatively fast tends to help, but a lot of chicks pretty much just become boring mothers after having kids, they almost loose all other interests, and yes most guys are basically immune, sure they mention their kids, but its not the only topic
 

lucky1

TRIBE Member
I hate doctors who don't follow up on blood work / tests what have you. The results are telling them something, but they don't talk to the patient or look into it ::mad:...! But I could write a book on my bad experiences with doctors!

IGstar, I'm glad you have a decent doc now, who is being thorough. I hope you get answers and it's nothing serious!

36 is not that old if you want kids. We met with a reproductive endocrinologist before my stem cell transplant, and he told us that under 40 is sort of the new number in terms of fertility treatments. He said if someone is over 35 and wants kids, and has been actively trying with no luck on their own he recommends to get a referral to a fertility doctor after 6 months of trying for a complete work up, including blood work, and ultrasound etc. (this part is covered by ohip)
 
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KillaLadY

TRIBE Member
yah, it could be nothing...who knows. It's just the way it all happened kinda concerned me. I miscarried a couple years back (that was the shining moment when I realized HOLY SHIT I DO WANT KIDS, which sucked. but I digress..) anyways...they didn't do the d&c properly, THANKS. so had to go back 2x for that ordeal, what a nightmare.

my periods were never the same after that. they got worse, more painful, etc etc...then my family dr. sent me for this same u/s last year b.c I was having a constant dull pain...I never heard back, so assumed it was AOK.
fast foward to this may when I have a new family dr (old one retired) and during my physical she saw something...she asks "Did Dr. X not tell you about these cysts you have?
me " um...no."
her " have you been having bad menstrual cycles?"
me "um...yes."

her" ok well I don't want to concern you, have you seen a gyno anytime at all or just Dr.X?"
me "just her, never seen a gyno"

so she said she wants a 2nd opinion, that she was suprised my old dr. never followed up with me.
I dunno, the whole thing was just unsettling. The fact that AFTER that miscarriage, I never got pregnant again, I can't say we were over the top careful...so I dunno. LOL I'm sure I'm just being all paranoid and dumb...it's just from my experience (and others I'm sure)..when it rains, it pours.
stay tuned. haha
Doctors told me because I had fibromyalgia and 4 fibroids that will be very difficult to have kids, almost impossible. I switched my diet and when we started to have unprotected sex, I became pregnant within the first 3 weeks.
I too had a miscarriage at 14 weeks when I was 25 years old and again was told that will complicate things.

So take the advice from the doctor with the grain of salt, but do your own research, get second opinions and modify your diet/nutrition - you will be fine.
 

Pyrovitae

TRIBE Member
i could always have gone either way; i thought that i was too selfish to have children and that i liked my lifestyle the way it was but a little part of me also thought i'd regret not having children, especially when that would become a physical impossibility and no longer a decision that i would get to make.

anyway, i shouldn't be posting here because i *am* a breeder.

pregnancy was great. i felt glowing and liberated to be able to mostly eat whatever i wanted. it was the after that terrified me. birth was awful but not in the way i'd expected...i'd needed an emergency c section which was, prior to it happening, the worst thing that i could have imagined. even that wasn't so bad.

and being a mom? way better than i could have ever imagined. our daughter has brought so much joy to my life already and i don't feel less like 'me' or that i've made massive sacrifices either. my 35th birthday was spent in france, we had a nice day out as a little family and i had champagne and cavier after the baby went to bed.

for those who are contemplating children i'd say not to write it off completely. life can surprise you.
 

Persephone

TRIBE Member
This would probably get more discussion in the Mom thread.

But I'll bite...I have to say that it seems to me that parents are generally more lax these days. Read the article - a 2 year old throwing a tantrum and hurling a salt shaker into another diner's dish? Fuck, if I were the mother of that child I'd be mortified, and I'd offer to pay for the other patron's meal. There seems to be a trend of parent's not taking responsibility, shrugging bad child behaviour off (terrible twos?). I'm not saying all parents are like this - heck, I have friends who will get up from their meal to take their child straight home if he/she starts to throw a fit in public. This is what my parents did, and we quickly learned that going out to restaurants was a 'treat' and that we needed to behave a certain way if we wanted to have that treat. I think childless restaurant patrons can generally understand and tolerate some level of unexpectedness that comes with children in general - but there has to be some mutual level of respect for others coming from the child's parents as well.

There, I think I've made enough blanket statements to generate discussion :p
 
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KillaLadY

TRIBE Member
This society is very individualist... it's all about "me" and "my needs". Children are part of the society and God forbid they act out, because they are just that, children. God forbid they are brought into a restaurant that isn't "family restaurant"...

I try hard not to comment when it comes to this, especially because many people get offended, but I really find it very strange and it really saddens me to see how children are viewed here sometimes.
 

lucky1

TRIBE Member
Some places just are not for kids. If I go out for a nice romatic dinner at a place with expensive wine / expensive food for a later evening reservation and there was a bratty kid sitting next to us I'd be pretty upset I think? But other places I expect families and I enjoy seeing the kids (like Dimsum on a Sunday morning). So I don't think you need to ban kids, most parents I know do a good job of deciding where to bring the kids, and where they should not.

I agree with Persephone when we were growing up going to a restaurant was a treat, and we thought swiss chalet was fine dining (with the finger bowls)...:D As we got older we started going out more as a family to nicer places.
 

agentRC4

TRIBE Member
as a parent with two daughters, I totally get why some people would want to go to "child free zones"

Shoot, when my wife and I do get time to go out on a date, we always try and find a place that is child free. LOL

We want to enjoy our time and not have to listen to kids who's parents can't control them.

Killa, children can act out all they want, but the parents need to be aware and reel them in. Also its called being polite to those around you ;) Making sure you are not disturbing the other diners around you who are trying to enjoy their evening too. This is why we don't go out very much. I can't relax because I'm too busy making sure my kids are not disturbing other people (Boston Pizza and Johnny Bakers excluded) .

Even if it is a family friendly place, that doesn't mean the parents have cart blanche to do what they want and let the kids run wild. I liken it to parents on the playground more worried about talking to the other parents then watching their own little menace in the playground.

I can't tell you how many times I have spoken to a parent in the playground who is not watching their child and their child's behavior is putting my child at risk.

Children and the youth may be the future, but it doesn't mean people who chose not to have kids can't have a place without them.
 

rubytuesday

TRIBE Member
I'm fairly tolerant and even welcoming of kids in public spaces and restaurants (because they are people too) but I don't see how it's enjoyable for the parents to be trying to have a nice meal with their toddler running around. As it stands we can barely get through a meal at a mall food court these days, but it depends on the child's age and temperament. If I'm trying to have a sit down meal where I have to wait for my food I don't bring L, it's not relaxing or fun for any of us at this stage. I am hopeful when he's older we'll be able to go to more places together but for now we order in or get a babysitter.

I agree with the mom who says if she's eating out somewhere nice it's to have a break from kids. However I think the examples in the article are extremes, most kids are not that unruly, are they?
 

Persephone

TRIBE Member
This society is very individualist... it's all about "me" and "my needs".
I think you can apply that same logic to the other side of the argument too, no?

I just think that there should be some level of mutual respect between diners with and without children alike. I don't think there are many patrons these days who expect children to be "seen and not heard." There are, of course, shades of grey and the posted article presented some extremes.
 
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