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The Toronto Real Estate Market

mariazmess

TRIBE Member
Ive never asked anyone to sign a representation agreement before making an offer. and even then, I only make the term like 14 days. it's a required part of an offer, btw. Confirmation of Representation.
that's different. but someone who asks me to sign a rep agreement right off the bat... ick. makes me feel roped in to something i don't wanna be roped in to.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
i'm not giving an agent a percentage of my shit for not helping me find a place. (i know they do much more than just help you find a place, but still...)

the listing side pays your agent, not you, the buyer.
anyway, thats the reason I got into this business besides boredom at what I was doing previously. there are so many fucking whack and inept agents in this city. it's not too hard to do your job properly (since it does pay so well in the first place) and gain a good reputation.
 

KillaLadY

TRIBE Member
that's different. but someone who asks me to sign a rep agreement right off the bat... ick. makes me feel roped in to something i don't wanna be roped in to.
You are totally entitled to refuse to sign the paper, but my duty as a salesperson is to really explain to you what I can or cannot do for you, and the only reason why you would cringe not to sign is always due to misinformation/or lackthereof. Teaching and explaining is KEY in buying/selling a house.

If you were completely comfortable with an agent that is there to help you find whatever you are looking for while being realistic in terms of how much you are willing to pay, I am sure you will be comfortable signing the representation agreement.

This is why I agree when saying that there are too few of good agents out there and to have a poor experience when you make one of the biggest decisions of your life will definitely make you hate agents or dealing with them.

And there there are the good ones that just make you realize how important they are for you when buying/selling a house and you wouldn't want to do such transaction without them.

I had that experience, when I bought my last property, I had one of the most amazing woman that was such a pleasure to deal with. I think that changed my outlook and made me interested in becoming one.
 

octo

TRIBE Member
i've picked out where I want to buy. my agent (sister in law) signed me up for something that's supposed to send me an email when a unit gets listed at that address. before i signed up there was at least 1 listing/month. in the past 3 months there's been nothing. right now it's for the best cause i'm trying save more.
 

kuba

TRIBE Member
i'll be looking to buy a place next year, hopefully, but not looking forward to it.
when i heard about that "sign this form so that you won't go with any other real estate agent" form it kinda made me cringe...

what if you're not showing me all that's out there? what if another agent does?? fuck you! i had too many friends find their own places and have to tell the agent, "hey, what about this place"... i'm not giving an agent a percentage of my shit for not helping me find a place. (i know they do much more than just help you find a place, but still...)

ug. i hate how expensive downtown is!
This kind of heresay misinformation makes me sick. Speak to a a realtor and not your friends when making a big purchase like a house or condo. I think others here have already explained how the process works.
 

swenard

TRIBE Member
This kind of heresay misinformation makes me sick. Speak to a a realtor and not your friends when making a big purchase like a house or condo. I think others here have already explained how the process works.
Exactly, my realtor only made me sign that document, while we were closing a house. His words were "Some dirty realtors =will make you sign this as soon as you talk to them but why would I want to force you to work with me, if you don't want to?"

It makes sense that the only realtor that is going to force you to sign that document is one that is afraid you won't like working with them.
 

kuba

TRIBE Member
On one hand I understand the buyers agency agreement. Agents spend a wack on gas, time, and other costs to show properties with nothing at the end to show for it. On the other hand, GOOD agents won't need it because the buyer will feel comfortable with them anyways.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
exactly. Im selling myself, not a house.
Ive never had an issue with people screwing me when they are serious and Im working for them.
it's the people who arent serious Im leery of, but I have developed a series of questions to weed out time-wasters.
 

Puma

TRIBE Member
Exactly, my Realtor only made me sign that document, while we were closing a house. His words were "Some dirty Realtors =will make you sign this as soon as you talk to them but why would I want to force you to work with me, if you don't want to?"

It makes sense that the only Realtor that is going to force you to sign that document is one that is afraid you won't like working with them.
The agency agreement is to protect the agent from the buyer screwing the agent. For example if there is no agency agreement the agent can waste his/her time with showing the client houses and doing all the work. When the agent finds a house the client likes, there is nothing stopping the client from going directly to the seller and making a deal without the agent being compensated for his/her work.

even if you sign an agency agreement and if you don't like your agent you don't have to work with them you can stop the process anytime you like. the only thing you cant do is buy the house what the agent showed you while being under an agency contract.

The agency contract is not as much of a bad thing as some people make it out to be. But people don't like to sign things especially in the beginning of the process so Realtors have to use creative ways to get you to sign it.

real estate agents hardest job is to weed out the people who are not interested and or cant really afford to buy a house but still insist on you working with them for free. If you don't buy anything the agent doesn't get paid so all that work was for free.
 
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Thunder

TRIBE Member
honestly though 2 days dom for anything with a semblance of decency is what's going on right now it's insane
 

halo five

TRIBE Member
Finding a good agent is hell. We went through three prototypical used car salesmen before we met 'our guy', and I'd recommend him to anyone. Consistently went above and beyond, but that's what I expect when he's getting 5% of a house out of it.

So, in my experience, they're not all bad. Just 3/4 of them.

We're also thinking about selling and renting for a bit if the market is still this fantasy-land crazy in the new year.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
honestly though 2 days dom for anything with a semblance of decency is what's going on right now it's insane

thats why right now, worrying about what other offers are aren't too much of a big deal. if it's a nice property, well priced, it's going to sell over asking, and all a prospective buyer should concern themselves with is coming up with a number they're comfortable with. chances are, someone is outbidding you if you're that worried.
Im flooded with renters this month. like, absolutely flooded. and my listings are high end units, not cheap. attracting doctors and the like. I want to stop and ask these people why theyre not buying.
 

AshG

Member
mediocre ROI vs S&P, coupled with an alternatively more plush lifestyle and convenience, with none of the upkeep headaches, not to mention land transfer taxes and the accompanying nuisances of bidding wars... if i had to hazard a guess.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
all of that is trumped by equity, I would think.

I know why I rent, and I know it's totally due to my personal spending habits and what's on the bottom line of my accounts.
 

saskboy

TRIBE Member
just found this, somewhat interesting

beware the !

(from freakonomics)

How Is the Ku Klux Klan Like a Group of Real-Estate Agents?

Going undercover in the Ku Klux Klan . . . Why experts of every kind are in the perfect position to exploit you . . . The antidote to information abuse: the Internet . . . Why a new car is suddenly worth so much less the moment it leaves the lot . . . Breaking the real-estate agent code: what “well maintained” really means . . . Is Trent Lott more racist than the average Weakest Link contestant? . . . What do online daters lie about?

A big part of a real-estate agent’s job, it would seem, is to persuade the homeowner to sell for less than he would like while at the same time letting potential buyers know that a house can be bought for less than its listing price. To be sure, there are more subtle means of doing so than coming right out and telling the buyer to bid low. The study of real-estate agents cited earlier also includes data that reveals how agents convey information through the for-sale ads they write. A phrase like “well maintained,” for instance, is as full of meaning to an agent as the code phrase “Mr. Ayak” was to a member of the Ku Klux Klan; it means that a house is old but not quite falling down. A savvy buyer will know this (or find out for himself once he sees the house), but to the sixty-five-year-old retiree who is selling his house, “well maintained” might sound like a compliment, which is just what the agent intends.

An analysis of the language used in real-estate ads shows that certain words are powerfully correlated with the final sale price of a house. This doesn’t necessarily mean that labeling a house “well maintained” causes it to sell for less than an equivalent house. It does, however, indicate that when a real-estate agent labels a house “well maintained,” she is subtly encouraging a buyer to bid low.

Listed below are ten terms commonly used in real-estate ads. Five of them have a strong positive correlation to the ultimate sales price, and five have a strong negative correlation. Guess which are which.

Ten Common Real-Estate Ad Terms

* Fantastic
* Granite
* Spacious
* State-of-the-Art
* !
* Corian
* Charming
* Maple
* Great Neighborhood
* Gourmet

A “fantastic” house is surely fantastic enough to warrant a high price, isn’t? What about a “charming” and “spacious” house in a “great neighborhood!”? No, no, no, and no. Here’s the breakdown:

Five Terms Correlated to a Higher Sales Price

* Granite
* State-of-the-Art
* Corian
* Maple
* Gourmet

Five Terms Correlated to a Lower Sales Price

* Fantastic
* Spacious
* !
* Charming
* Great Neighborhood

Three of the five terms correlated with a higher sales price are physical descriptions of the house itself: granite, Corian, and maple. As information goes, such terms are specific and straightforward—and therefore pretty useful. If you like granite, you might like the house; but even if you don’t, “granite” certainly doesn’t connote a fixer-upper. Nor does “gourmet” or “state-of-the-art,” both of which seem to tell a buyer that a house is, on some level, truly fantastic.

“Fantastic,” meanwhile, is a dangerously ambiguous adjective, as is “charming.” Both these words seem to be real-estate agent code for a house that doesn’t have many specific attributes worth describing. “Spacious” homes, meanwhile, are often decrepit or impractical. “Great neighborhood” signals a buyer that, well, this house isn’t very nice but others nearby may be. And an exclamation point in a real estate ad is bad news for sure, a bid to paper over real shortcomings with false enthusiasm.

If you study the words in the ad for a real-estate agent’s own home, meanwhile, you see that she indeed emphasizes descriptive terms (especially “new,” “granite,” “maple,” and “move-in condition”) and avoids empty adjectives (including “wonderful,” “immaculate,” and the telltale “!”). Then she patiently waits for the best buyer to come along. She might tell this buyer about a house nearby that just sold for $25,000 above the asking price, or another house that is currently the subject of a bidding war. She is careful to exercise every advantage of the information asymmetry she enjoys.
 

kennyboy

TRIBE Member
I`d like to know how much equity all these buyers are coming in with. I haven`t lived in TO in 6 years, but I do recall when I was looking to buy that many peolpe were buying with the absolute minimum down payment, bidding up the price, and were pretty much mortgage`d out the ying yang.

Is that still the case, and is that what`s driving the market again.

When my wife and I bought our new place last year in KW, we dropped 30% down and I had a hard time dealing with that (I just hate seeing that big mortgage number on the books), so I can`t even imagine a 5 or 10% down stroke.
 

dj Red Turtle

TRIBE Promoter
that's different. but someone who asks me to sign a rep agreement right off the bat... ick. makes me feel roped in to something i don't wanna be roped in to.
We have at our office an Ultimate Service Guarantee. If you sign an agreement with us and we don't accomplish what we promised. You have the right to fire us if we don't rectify the situation within 24hrs.

I think that's a fair relationship.
 

octo

TRIBE Member
i don't understand how people have a hard time finding a good real estate agent.

it's seems like every third person i know has become one. a lot of them are dumbasses but there's some i'd put my trust in.
 

Rajio

Well-Known TRIBEr
On this subject, why does every realtor think we care what they look like? Every realtor puts their glamorshot on everything, bigger than their name. Bigger than their phone number. like dude, i dont give a shit what you look like. just buy/sell my property. this isn't a date.
I would still like an answer to this - come on. I know some of you reading this are in real estate. Provide some insight please.
 

AshG

Member
all of that is trumped by equity, I would think.

I know why I rent, and I know it's totally due to my personal spending habits and what's on the bottom line of my accounts.
S&P has easily outstripped the real estate market over the past 25 years.
see previous threads on this very subject.

edit:
the real estate market only comes into line with ROI in comparison with the S&P because of the lack of capital gains tax, IF it happens to be your principle residence. even then, its parity mind you, nothing more.
it comes down to, as you mention, lifestyle choices. the financial component really has nothing to offer compared to zero knowledge investing.
 
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madnezz

TRIBE Member
Here's a question for the agents in this thread:

If someone was planning to buy a property for $750k that was locked down and a sure bet, would you consider giving $5k of your commission to the buyer if it means you get to represent them? Remember, this deal is happening with or without you, the only variable being whether the selling agent gets both sides of the commission, or if you collude with the buyer to give them this $5k kick-back in order to be part of the deal.

Nobody has to know except you and the buyer that this kick-back happened.

Would you go for it?
 

bitchass

TRIBE Member
Here's a question for the agents in this thread:

If someone was planning to buy a property for $750k that was locked down and a sure bet, would you consider giving $5k of your commission to the buyer if it means you get to represent them? Remember, this deal is happening with or without you, the only variable being whether the selling agent gets both sides of the commission, or if you collude with the buyer to give them this $5k kick-back in order to be part of the deal.

Nobody has to know except you and the buyer that this kick-back happened.

Would you go for it?
Not worth losing your license over to do it under the table. That said, there are probably a lot of starving agents on their way out that would jump on it.

Every jurisdiction is different and there are some that allow this to be done as long as full disclosure is given and the money is paid by the brokerage and not directly from the agent.
 
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