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The Toronto Real Estate Market

kuba

TRIBE Member
is crazy. nuts. insane. house goes up for sale, open house, some private viewings, maybe a home inspection, sells. BOOM. insane! I hate the idea behind competition. Bids should be transparent, no? How do we know what we're up against?

I'm not an interested buyer right now - but boy do I feel sorry for those who are.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
it's ridiculous. Im even getting involved in multiple offers on rentals. there is no inventory. no idea what people are waiting for.
Listings will rise though, in the new year.
some stats for those interested...

In the first two weeks of October, Greater Toronto REALTORS reported 3,631 sales – up 34 per cent compared to the first two weeks of October 2008.

The average price for these transactions was up 17 per cent year-over-year to $414,479.
 

AshG

Member
it's ridiculous. Im even getting involved in multiple offers on rentals. there is no inventory. no idea what people are waiting for.
Listings will rise though, in the new year.
some stats for those interested...

In the first two weeks of October, Greater Toronto REALTORS reported 3,631 sales – up 34 per cent compared to the first two weeks of October 2008.

The average price for these transactions was up 17 per cent year-over-year to $414,479.
not to say its not a busy market, but you ARE, after all, comparing the now to what was probably the absolute worst economic month in the past several decades - of course its going to be up an assload from then.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
correct. I was directly comparing to last year.
Ill paste more...

"While demand for existing homes has remained strong, it is important to recognize the
context of current statistics. We are now making comparisons to the fall of 2008 when we
experienced a marked decline in sales and average price," said TREB President Tom
Lebour.
Year-to-date sales, at 69,964 are up six per cent compared to 2008. Average price, at
$389,687, is up by two per cent.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
I cant paste actual figures for that unless I went through and worked it out. what we get is a breakdown by district. just looking at a few popular ones, yes, both strong.

people just need to get their confidence back and start listing and we'll be in a nice place on all ends.

here's a quote that backs up what I pasted earlier as beyond just positivity compared to the last dismal year..

“Existing home sales will finish
strong this year, pushing through
the 80,000 mark and moving in
line with some of the best years
on record under the current TREB
market area,” according to Jason
Mercer, TREB’s Senior Manager of
Market Analysis.
 
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OTIS

TRIBE Member
Toronto's population projections are set to rise into the near future so it's only natural that our market will be healthy for a while. Still, insanely low lending rates are injecting a lot of hot air into the market. I hope the powers at be are paying attention to the systemic risk that brings.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
I hate the idea behind competition. Bids should be transparent, no? How do we know what we're up against?

I wont be able to sleep yet, so I might as well dive into this can of worms for a bit. The way the system is currently set up, if I want to engage multiple offers on my listing, Ill set the price a bit low (this isnt fooling any other agents, it's really more of a 'look at me, Im going for multiples') and hold back offers for a week. so on 'offer day', typically I can expect at least 4 offers. now, price isnt the only factor at all. Ive seen lower offers accepted because of fewer clauses like financing or inspections omitted. then again, in june, an agent in my office was in an situation where 18 offers were registered and the listing sold 82,000 over asking. insanity. and this was south etobicoke, not king west.
Im on the fence with the ethics involved. on one hand, yes, I think there should be transparency, but I dont know how that could work in these scenarios. all offers are coming in within a matter of a couple hours. how would agent A know what agent B did. if the process were to last a few days on a less popular listing, then sure, this could work out I suppose.
on the other hand, it is fair in its own right. you have one chance, and youre going to regret it either way. if you win, you'll think you paid too much. if you lose, chances are youre pissed with your agent. I advise people to consider it all carefully and come up with a figure that is within their means and matches their enthusiam to the property. I provide opinion given my estimations from experience, but I dont press. keeps my reputation safe.
you have to remember, everyone else is in the same boat.
 

Rajio

Well-Known TRIBEr
On this subject, why does every realtor think we care what they look like? Every realtor puts their glamorshot on everything, bigger than their name. Bigger than their phone number. like dude, i dont give a shit what you look like. just buy/sell my property. this isn't a date.
 

acheron

TRIBE Member
here's something I've noticed.

Just to use the several examples I've seen recently about home sales... Toronto Life had a feature on a realtor who sold some crazy number of houses in a month, way more than usual, like one a day or more. But looking at the final price compared to asking, almost all of them were below asking. Then two of my friends sold their houses recently for slightly below asking. Then I keep seeing stuff in the globe's real estate featured sales and most of them are below asking (usually only 5-10 grand, very few above asking)...

What I'm wondering is if there isn't some scotching of the data here when people say houses are selling for x% above last year's average price, does this mean that the valuations out there were dramatically higher than the realistic (selling) price, but the real price was still a bit higher than last year? Are real estate agents overvaluing homes on purpose to give buyers the perception they're getting a deal when they bargain the seller down?

It wouldn't surprise me if this isn't some new trend among realtors. Just like the trend of holding back offers took hold a few years back.
 

AshG

Member
here's something I've noticed.

Just to use the several examples I've seen recently about home sales... Toronto Life had a feature on a realtor who sold some crazy number of houses in a month, way more than usual, like one a day or more. But looking at the final price compared to asking, almost all of them were below asking. Then two of my friends sold their houses recently for slightly below asking. Then I keep seeing stuff in the globe's real estate featured sales and most of them are below asking (usually only 5-10 grand, very few above asking)...

What I'm wondering is if there isn't some scotching of the data here when people say houses are selling for x% above last year's average price, does this mean that the valuations out there were dramatically higher than the realistic (selling) price, but the real price was still a bit higher than last year? Are real estate agents overvaluing homes on purpose to give buyers the perception they're getting a deal when they bargain the seller down?

It wouldn't surprise me if this isn't some new trend among realtors. Just like the trend of holding back offers took hold a few years back.
again, considering EVERYTHING was at record lows last year, its almost impossible not to make some farbricated % gain over what something might have sold at last year, but its a meaningless number since those who sold recently didn't in fact sell last year.

its the same thing with any commodity, stocks included.

its all a shell game until the moment you actually buy - and then later - sell.

who in their right mind would have sold in last year's conditions?
only those in desperate need of capital, so its hardly a basis for comparison.

moreover, who bought at those record lows to begin with?
as with all commodities, you have to look at long term trends to determine % gain, otherwise almost ANY kind of % gain is possible, if you choose your time periods of comparision just right.... Oct 2008 vs Oct. 2009 for example.
 

Fillmore

TRIBE Member
The report just came out last week for our building. The condos are on the market for an average of 4-6 days. They amount of money people are making is insane right now too.
 

guysmiley

TRIBE Member
Still, insanely low lending rates are injecting a lot of hot air into the market. I hope the powers at be are paying attention to the systemic risk that brings.
There's never been an issue with people leveraging low rates to buy homes they couldn't otherwise afford.
 

vinder

TRIBE Member
There's never been an issue with people leveraging low rates to buy homes they couldn't otherwise afford.
let's be honest, almost ~50% of the cost of a house is mortage interest. the selling price of a house is not reflective of the true cost. if interest rates are lowered, people's buying power increases. it's not a reflection of their ability to pay for a $500k house.

low interest rates have been a reality for years, expecting a jump back to the double digits like in the late 80's early 90's is unrealistic.

now people buying houses in the hopes of flipping them quickly and failing when they can't even afford the house, that's another story altogether. that's just a poor business decision.
 

groovespinna

TRIBE Member
On this subject, why does every realtor think we care what they look like? Every realtor puts their glamorshot on everything, bigger than their name. Bigger than their phone number. like dude, i dont give a shit what you look like. just buy/sell my property. this isn't a date.
my card has no picture. I agree it's totally ridiculous.
 

rawd

TRIBE Member
On this subject, why does every realtor think we care what they look like? Every realtor puts their glamorshot on everything, bigger than their name. Bigger than their phone number. like dude, i dont give a shit what you look like. just buy/sell my property. this isn't a date.
There was an awesome one that used to be on my route home. Guaranteed it was a Glamour Shot, holding an older fat Blackberry, smokey Photoshop filter. She would make all your dreams come true
 
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