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The NDP are COMMIES

Boss Hog

TRIBE Member
Fuck those NDPers, wanting to share out cake and shit when a brother is only trying to make a dollar and a cent.

Fuck those guys! File your NDP complaints here:
 
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Layton is a tool who will only pursue an idea if he can get his name on it.
They have yet to decide is they are a labour party or a green party.
Layton clearly takes advatage of private healthcare when availible yet pretends he didn't know.
The specifically target people with lower educations and who don't speak english.
 

TrIbAlNuT

TRIBE Member
Ditto Much said:
Layton clearly takes advatage of private healthcare when availible yet pretends he didn't know.
.

not true! he went to a private clinic that deals with OHIP patients, he didn't pay a cent nor was he put above other patients.
 
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
TrIbAlNuT said:
not true! he went to a private clinic that deals with OHIP patients, he didn't pay a cent nor was he put above other patients.

Yet when asked about it one week previous to it going to the press he clearly knew. See he was listing off operations he and his wife had in past. The only one he didn't list was the one done at a private clinic. Joe Clarke took one in the ass for going to the exact same clinic, Layton gets the same.

He knew! he was happy to do it.

Private clinics can perform public operations is all that the conservatives have ever said, I argue layton is living proof.
 

Boss Hog

TRIBE Member
So Layton would rather lay his political reputation on the line rather than get the same health care everyone else gets?
 

SellyCat

TRIBE Member
I say that if there are Private clinics, then the quality of care minimums in public hospitals should be upped---or even placed on a schedule to ensure constant and consistent improvement. Cuz you don't wanna have shit-ass crappy hospitals for people who can't afford the private stuff.

Of course the corporate class wants to profit off private healthcare while encouraging the government to lower spending on public healthcare to force people into exactly that situation.

Even if they're not doing it dliberately, they must be aware that that will be the result.
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Boss Hog said:
So Layton would rather lay his political reputation on the line rather than get the same health care everyone else gets?


No but its my fault...


Layton argues that nothing in the medical system should be privatized and has ever since being the leader to the NDP. He is always very passionate about this and the party literature is very consistent on this.

I however argue that he doesn't personally believe it.

While running the finances for the city of Toronto he was well aware that Mel Lastman went to the same public clinic, he was aware that Joe Clark went to that clinic, he went to the same clinic and then left it out of his list intentionally when reporters asked about it. He lied claiming to not know it was private when confronted, and he is directly contradicting his parties platform and his advertised platform.

He if anything is proof that a private clinic can operate for decades in support of a public health system without it being publicly owned and operated. He supported them when they were there for him and then argues that they should exist to begin with.
 

Boss Hog

TRIBE Member
Well, to be honest I don't know much about it but it sounds like there has to be more to the story. It doesn't really add up.
 
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Boss Hog said:
Well, to be honest I don't know much about it but it sounds like there has to be more to the story. It doesn't really add up.


I'll dig up my specific post in regards to my issue with him. The health care thing is limited in my personal opinion.

The NDP will need to select a leader other than Chow, Layton or Rae before I consider them.
 

Flashy_McFlash

Well-Known TRIBEr
Ditto Much said:
No but its my fault...


Layton argues that nothing in the medical system should be privatized and has ever since being the leader to the NDP. He is always very passionate about this and the party literature is very consistent on this.

I however argue that he doesn't personally believe it.

While running the finances for the city of Toronto he was well aware that Mel Lastman went to the same public clinic, he was aware that Joe Clark went to that clinic, he went to the same clinic and then left it out of his list intentionally when reporters asked about it. He lied claiming to not know it was private when confronted, and he is directly contradicting his parties platform and his advertised platform.

He if anything is proof that a private clinic can operate for decades in support of a public health system without it being publicly owned and operated. He supported them when they were there for him and then argues that they should exist to begin with.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this story completely debunked? I remember reading something like that during the campaign.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
Ditto Much said:
I'll dig up my specific post in regards to my issue with him. The health care thing is limited in my personal opinion.

The NDP will need to select a leader other than Chow, Layton or Rae before I consider them.


ditto ive pointed this out to you before,

layton did not go to a private clinic, he was confused about the nature of the Shouldice clinic but he's not required to know everything about it, he was ref'd to it by his doctor because they are the best at hernia surgery,
they do not make profits, any excess funds they recv'd are sent back to the government.

besides all PM's from what i understand have private medical care, they would all be guilty of it because private care is widely availble in quebec.
 

TrIbAlNuT

TRIBE Member
judge wopner said:
layton did not go to a private clinic, he was confused about the nature of the Shouldice clinic but he's not required to know everything about it, he was ref'd to it by his doctor because they are the best at hernia surgery,
they do not make profits, any excess funds they recv'd are sent back to the government.

Exactly, but you it sounds way better when people get to say that Layton went to a private clinic.

Shouldice was mandated by the Ontario government to perform minor general procedures to take the pressure of the hospitals.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
TrIbAlNuT said:
Exactly, but you it sounds way better when people get to say that Layton went to a private clinic.

Shouldice was mandated by the Ontario government to perform minor general procedures to take the pressure of the hospitals.

dont ask why i know this but shouldice started around WW2 while mass enlistment for the military was happening. too many otherwise fit men were being declined entry to the CF because upon medical examination they had hernia's. these could become inflamed or irritated during the rigours of training and leave a man handicapped for long periods if left untreated.

so a dr. shouldice apparently devised a quick way to perform simple hernia repairs to get men ready for active service pronto.

after doing so many cases en mass they were able to refine and improve on the technique. it was hyper-specialization that allowed them to speed up recovery time and limit post-operative complications.

they continued the tradition to this day in teh grey area of our health-accord, but for certain they do not charge, they do not run "at a profit" to any board or shareholders. they are given extensive donations by grateful patients and also serve as an international place for hernia repair and study.
 
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Flashy_McFlash said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this story completely debunked? I remember reading something like that during the campaign.


Jack Layton said:
It’s the municipal workers, the librarians, the transport workers and the long term care givers - like those who gave my Dad the comfort he needed - the kind of comfort and care you just don’t get in privatized facilities.


CUPE Convention Winnipeg, October 6 2005


His operation was more than a decade earlier and he was well aware of the fact that it was a private facility. He campaigned against them unti caught with his pants down.
 

SlipperyPete

TRIBE Member
we've been over the Shouldice thing before.

yes, they are privately run.
however, they charge the going rate that any facility in ontario would charge for the procedures they provide. as a specialized facility, they are able to provide a higher level of care for those who need their specialized form of treatment. this specialized treatment they provide leads to shorter stays *and* a lower rate of re-occurrance, thus lowering present and future costs per patient.

that is the end.
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
SlipperyPete said:
we've been over the Shouldice thing before.


Does it look like a standard public hospital?


Leftside.jpg
 
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man_slut

TRIBE Member
Hey I agree he had a shitty past and admits it. he was also in office during a Recession which means anybody that would have filled his shoes would have gotten a bad rap... as did Mike Harris soon after.

Look at his credentials now.
 

man_slut

TRIBE Member
Labour is a lost cause for the NDP. Labour (in Canada) has been co-opted and beleives they too can strike it rich and must therefore resist left wing policy.

Sustainable policy development would help the NDP gain more green votes but not much. Most Green party members are moderate right wingers that want to feel good about thier capitalist endeaveurs by supporting an "enviromental" party.

I think supporting small business would do a lot for the NDP party. So far this is controlled by the Conservatives.
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
I agree that the NDP have got to drop public unions from there major supporters if they want to find me as a member.
 

~atp~

TRIBE Member
man_slut said:
Most Green party members are moderate right wingers that want to feel good about thier capitalist endeaveurs by supporting an "enviromental" party.


You think so? I would say that may be true in the short-term past...but not in general.
 

~atp~

TRIBE Member
Anyone know of a worthwhile anarcho-syndicalist party in Canada?

If not, anyone want to help me start one?
 
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