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The Mayor's Race

janiecakes

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
Miller backed the ARA? Wow .... as if I needed yet another reason not to vote for him. :)
Yes he did, because ARA was pissed that anti-immigrant organizers using neo-nazis as security guards were holding meetings on City property - Swansea Town Hall (which is against the bylaws - you need to have an anti-discrimination policy if you use City space for meetings which they quite obviously didn't have), and he appears to be a reasonable man (unlike some people on this message board).

OH THE HORROR
 

mingster

TRIBE Member
had a look at the websites last night...and whoa! could david miller be any more perfect for mayor of toronto?

go david miller!



john tory's website looks like a rip-off of rogers.com.
 

AdRiaN

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by janiecakes
Yes he did, because ARA was pissed that anti-immigrant organizers using neo-nazis as security guards were holding meetings on City property
The ARA are nothing more than a bunch of violent thugs, and they deserve the support of nobody. I don't care if the ARA claims to be fighting against racism ... you don't accomplish anything by fighting fire with fire. I can't stand behind a politician who supports this kind of behaviour.
 

kodos

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by janiecakes
So Tory's been cleared in the bribery scandal by York Region Police and David Miller is calling on Nunziata to give the public the info he gave police.

Miller is now at 37%, Tory is at 31% and Hall is at 19% with 22% undecided.

There was a record turnout at advance polls, with 42,599 votes cast compared to 36,000 last election.

There's a debate tonight on that new Toronto 1 station from 7 to 9.
So the police, who actively endorse Tory, cleared him of wrong-doing? That was highly unexpected!

I had a chuckle at some tidbit in Now/Eye/some rag about rating candidates by their lawn signs... the comment about Miller looking like a zombie cracks me up all the time. Zombie mayor! Man he's got my vote... now if only he can promise to not feast on the flesh of his constituents, but perhaps thats asking too much...
 

janiecakes

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
The ARA are nothing more than a bunch of violent thugs, and they deserve the support of nobody.
This is garbage.

Anyway, kodos - it was York Region police I believe who cleared Tory, who was endorsed by the Toronto Police Union. Still!
 
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Interchange

TRIBE Promoter
A few years back when i was a starving student i did canvassing for Dennis Mills toronto-danforth MP we had to go house to house and ask people what they thought.

well i walked right into John nunzitas sister-in-laws house and boy did she have a mouth fulll to say.

Calling him a racist, biggot - her sister was in a middle of a divorce to him because he had many affairs on her, there was a bunch of childern in this womans house and she said they wer his and how they were in a middle of a law suit becsue he was not paying child support.

when i saw john nuzitas face on the subaways ad signs for the first time i wanted to run home grab some paint balls and start firing away.. and then to see all the finger pointing he was doing in the papers about being bribed, it confirmend it even further to me how much of a slime this rat man really is.

in last weeks NOW there was a little write up about him - saying how last time he was in office --- or something he wanted to make it so woman could be put in jail if they had abortions...and there was some other fuked up shit to.

Please if you were considering voting for him reconsider this man should not be allowed to run.
 

mingster

TRIBE Member
i simply cannot comprehend how miller is the ONLY candidate opposing the island airport.

are they rest of them total fucking idiots?
 

KickIT

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by mingster
i simply cannot comprehend how miller is the ONLY candidate opposing the island airport.

are they rest of them total fucking idiots?
Barb is an idiot and the rest seems to want to cater to Mr. Deluce who wants to start a new airline from the island. He's threatening a massive lawsuit against the city if the bridge proposal is shot down.

According to Miller:

"We (city) have no agreement with Bob Deluce so he would have a (weak) basis for a lawsuit," says Miller, a trained lawyer and city councillor. "This is the seventh time that the TPA has said they will proceed (with a bridge) yet they don’t have the approvals yet. They are desperate and are trying to do this before the election," Miller told the Town Crier.
So Mr. Deluce can take his airline and shove it up his ass. And if he tries to sue the city, he should be escorted out of the city forever, though he's probably from the 905 anyways.

Here's a good article.

Also, if Mr. Deluce wants to start an airline, why not have it operate from Pearson using the billion dollars in renovations we're doing there?

*c*
 
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AdRiaN

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by mingster
i simply cannot comprehend how miller is the ONLY candidate opposing the island airport.
Maybe that's because the issue isn't as black and white as you think.
 
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
Maybe that's because the issue isn't as black and white as you think.
yeah money comes in many different colour here in canada.



(I'm against the island airport, I don't think it makes any real sense without a very large increase in air traffic. I don't think that a large increase in air traffic will imporve Toronto in the down town core. Buttonville makes more sense and Pearson has an empty terminal, the only reason Toronto Island would be expanded is to prevent sauga from getting the landing fees)
 

KickIT

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
Maybe that's because the issue isn't as black and white as you think.
What's so black and white?

The Island residents don't want it and I'm sure most of the people living downtown don't want it. The only person who wants it is Mr. Deluce.

*c*
 

AdRiaN

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by KickIT
The Island residents don't want it and I'm sure most of the people living downtown don't want it. The only person who wants it is Mr. Deluce.
If nobody wants the island airport expansion, then why do roughly 75% of decided voters support candidates who are in favour of the project?

I live downtown, and I support the project.
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
If nobody wants the island airport expansion, then why do roughly 75% of decided voters support candidates who are in favour of the project?

I live downtown, and I support the project.
making the assumption that everyone who is against miller is for the airport seems pretty iffy!
 

FC St. Pauli

TRIBE Member
hey Adrian

why do you support the island airport project?

(real question)

I cannot think of any real benefit for someone who lives here

I want a rail link to the real airport like in a 1/2 decent city - for me the degradation of Toronto's best park and waterfront in general, noise and pollution would be secondary to the fact it might delay (for ages) the building of a needed link to Pearson

What are the benefits?
 
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mingster

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
If nobody wants the island airport expansion, then why do roughly 75% of decided voters support candidates who are in favour of the project?

I live downtown, and I support the project.

you can't assume that because a voter supports a candidate that they agree with all of their policies, or are even aware of that candidates' opinions on the matter. it seems to me a couple of candidates haven't even given this issue the attention it deserves in their platforms. they could easily be supporting a candidate for another reason.

75% support /= 75% support for the airport.
 

kodos

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by KickIT
The Island residents don't want it and I'm sure most of the people living downtown don't want it. The only person who wants it is Mr. Deluce.
...and then there's the whole issue of Island residents vs the city... I wonder if that's going to get fired up any time soon?

Speaking of issues below the radar, I sure wish the Planetarium had been made part of someone's election platform... its a real shame that a significant site such as that, built with funds donated for the benefit of the public, is just being used as extra office space/storage and some rinkity-dinkity daycare (or whatever). I harboured this naive notion that the black-out would rekindle Toronto's fascination with the heavens but that's asking too much, obviously.

[/boringtheaudience]

The hair! The HAIR!! !
 

AdRiaN

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by FC St. Pauli
I want a rail link to the real airport like in a 1/2 decent city - for me the degradation of Toronto's best park and waterfront in general, noise and pollution would be secondary to the fact it might delay (for ages) the building of a needed link to Pearson
See ... here's the problem. In many people's minds, the issues of expanding the island airport and building a rail-link from downtown to Pearson are mutually exclusive. Why do you assume that one project would delay the other? They are both partnerships between several levels of government and the private sector. It's not like the City of Toronto is financing the entire cost.

I'm not sure where the other candidates stand, but I know that John Tory's platform favours the island airport expansion and a rail-link.

Why do I support the expansion? For starters, we already have an operational airport on the island. Some residents in the area are complaining about noise and pollution from the proposed increase in flights, but they're already experiencing the noise and pollution from the existing flights. If these people don't like planes flying around near their condos, they shouldn't have bought condos beside an airport!

Nobody is talking about allowing huge jet planes to zip around 24/7. The proposal is merely for an increase in the number of flights of the existing types of aircraft.

In addition, I think a lot of people underestimate the value of the island airport simply because they don't use it. The convenience of having an airport in very close proximity to Canada's largest commercial and financial centre is a bonus for short-haul business travellers. Just because leisure travellers generally don't use the island airport does not mean it's pointless.
 

AdRiaN

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by Ditto Much
making the assumption that everyone who is against miller is for the airport seems pretty iffy!
Of course. I was merely responding to the assumption that a) people who live downtown do not support the airport expansion, and b) the project is only supported by those with a financial interest.
 
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~atp~

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN

For starters, we already have an operational airport on the island.
Well that certainly doesn't imply that it needs to be expanded...


Some residents in the area are complaining about noise and pollution from the proposed increase in flights, but they're already experiencing the noise and pollution from the existing flights. If these people don't like planes flying around near their condos, they shouldn't have bought condos beside an airport!
Uh, yes, but how does that argument support the expansion argument? You're right, people don't want to have MORE noise to deal with, but they knew that when they moved there. So? Why not discuss the other obviously more important points:

a) pollution.
b) congestion.
c) noise pollution in general, not just near that airport.


Nobody is talking about allowing huge jet planes to zip around 24/7. The proposal is merely for an increase in the number of flights of the existing types of aircraft.


But it's still an increase. lol. And people have problems with this, mostly because of the pollution issues...noise, environment, etc.


In addition, I think a lot of people underestimate the value of the island airport simply because they don't use it. The convenience of having an airport in very close proximity to Canada's largest commercial and financial centre is a bonus for short-haul business travellers. Just because leisure travellers generally don't use the island airport does not mean it's pointless.
Hey! Your first point that really supports having the airport expanded!
But we should notice who the primary beneficiaries are in this case.... ;)
 

AdRiaN

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by ~atp~
But we should notice who the primary beneficiaries are in this case.... ;)
Interesting point, and it sort of ties into my earlier arguments about local residents. Since when did people care so much about rich condominiun owners who complain about some "undesirable" development in their vicinity, and its impact on property values? Are these rich condo owners armed with an environmental assessment to justify their concerns about the alleged dangers of expanding the airport? Why is there no skepticism about their opposition? Could this be yet another example of wealthy people simply protecting their investment rather than having a legitimate concern for the environment?
 

kodos

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by janiecakes
less hair more below the radar please
http://www.geocities.com/torontoplanetarium/home.html

Let's just say I really like this part of their objectives for obvious reasons:
To refurbish and reopen The McLaughlin Planetarium as a 300 seat Audio-Visual theater for use as a teaching planetarium during the day, and a very unique special events venue at night, featuring customizing and display options without equal.
But back to the serious stuff, f'real:
Toronto Star, March 31, 2002

Toronto desperately needs a planetarium
Nick Van der Graaf

On a warm summer night last year, I was visiting the family cottage with my wife and our teenaged nieces. Sitting out on the dock, swatting at mosquitoes, I looked up at the sky and saw an old friend. “Look,” I said to my 14-year-old niece Jennifer, “There’s Jupiter!”

She looked at me crossly and said “Oh yeah, right. How can you tell? Don’t lie!”
For her, the idea that one spot of light in the night sky is in fact different from all the others was incomprehensible. Constellations, and the planets that roam through them, were all one and the same to her, just a bunch of glowing dots entirely devoid of meaning or rapture.

Jennifer would have been just old enough to visit Toronto’s McLaughlin Planetarium when it closed in 1995. The planetarium was closed by the Royal Ontario Museum when the Harris government slashed museum funding so drastically the ROM was left with little choice. Attendance at the planetarium had been falling steadily, and after all, while the astronomy programs had been supplemented by laser shows, there were no business courses presented on the interior of the planetarium dome, so the Harrisites were probably pleased to see the thing go.

Since then the planetarium has been converted into the Children’s Own Museum, little more than a palace of basic stimulation for toddlers. Chunks of it are simply used for storage. This state of affairs is scandalous. Now that the ROM has selected a bold new design for its renewal and redevelopment, it is time to do the same for the planetarium.

I believe this city badly needs a planetarium. Like most North American urban areas, Toronto suffers from chronic light pollution. Even the brightest constellations are dim and unremarkable viewed from downtown, and the Milky Way, that breath-taking view of our own magnificent galaxy, is entirely invisible. A working planetarium can help Torontonians know what they’re missing and add to their understanding of their place in the cosmos.

To me this is the crux of the matter. A basic understanding of the night sky and our Earth’s place in it is crucial to how 21st century humans understand ourselves. Unfortunately, we live in a highly materialistic age that does not make understanding, context or profundity much of a priority.


The McLaughlin Planetarium opened in 1968, the result of a $2 million dollar gift from Canadian businessman Colonel R. Samuel McLaughlin. “Colonel Sam,” as he was known, was the president of General Motors Canada for decades. He didn’t see any conflict between private wealth and the public good; in fact he thought the former was good for the latter, as opposed to the way we run things in Ontario these days.

I remember what a terrific institution the McLaughlin Planetarium was. The astronomy exhibits in the galleries outside the actual star theatre were brilliantly conceived, particularly after some renovations in the early 1980s. One exhibit in particular still enchants me, if only in memory. It was a rotating 3D map of the local stellar neighbourhood. A meticulously crafted construction of thin wires, fibre optic filaments and tiny LEDs, this device was infinitely more instructive than any two-dimensional illustration. And like the star field it portrayed, it was a thing of beauty too.

The heart of the planetarium was the Zeiss projector. Working in combination with dozens of other projectors in the Star Theatre, the Zeiss could take the viewer to almost anywhere in time and space. Not only was the planetarium a remarkable learning tool, it was also the scene of pure magic. So not only does a planetarium have significant intellectual value, I would argue it has a certain spiritual quality as well.

And for all the talk that Toronto is a “world class” city, I couldn’t help but notice we are one of the very few major centres in the world that doesn’t have a planetarium. Vancouver has the H.R. MacMillan Planetarium. After a recent technical upgrade the Montreal Planetarium is better than ever. Winnipeg, Calgary, Edmonton, Sudbury and Hamilton all have one.

Outside of Canada it seems everybody has a planetarium. Only four U.S. states don’t have at least one. Germany alone has 30 out of more than 45 scattered across Europe. South Africa has two. South America has five. Surely the largest and richest city in one of the most developed nations in the world can mange to operate one as well?

Cities need more than just shopping and finance areas. They need places that are designed to cultivate the mind too. The ROM’s planned renewal and recent influx of cash from the Ontario government presents a window of opportunity to re-establish a new, revitalized McLaughlin Planetarium. The museum and the city will be all the richer for it.
I think that sez it all!
 

mingster

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
Interesting point, and it sort of ties into my earlier arguments about local residents. Since when did people care so much about rich condominiun owners who complain about some "undesirable" development in their vicinity, and its impact on property values? Are these rich condo owners armed with an environmental assessment to justify their concerns about the alleged dangers of expanding the airport? Why is there no skepticism about their opposition? Could this be yet another example of wealthy people simply protecting their investment rather than having a legitimate concern for the environment?

it's not just about the rich condo owners. some of the city's cheapest (and precious) housing is in this vicinity. which brings me to the question 'will an expanded island airport raise or lower the cost of the real estate in the area'? how is this going to affect affordable housing?

this development will benefit people with money first and foremost, so i ask you...how would that in turn benefit the people who's needs are still not being met. i'm not convinced that both can be achieved. i think if you cater to the people who will benefit from the airport, then lots of people are going to lose as a result.

also, it is likely (in my mind anyways) that an expanded island airport will hamper waterfront development, which is going to hurt everyone, equally and individually.

it is quite clear to me that the candidates who favour an expansion do not have the best interests of this city (and its citizens in mind), only that of a select few, who by no means should be considered needy or worthy of first consideration.
 
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KickIT

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by AdRiaN
Interesting point, and it sort of ties into my earlier arguments about local residents. Since when did people care so much about rich condominiun owners who complain about some "undesirable" development in their vicinity, and its impact on property values? Are these rich condo owners armed with an environmental assessment to justify their concerns about the alleged dangers of expanding the airport? Why is there no skepticism about their opposition? Could this be yet another example of wealthy people simply protecting their investment rather than having a legitimate concern for the environment?
Some of what you say is probably true. People always do look after their best interests. But really can you blame them? Wouldn't you do the same?

Also wouldn't you agree that a highspeed rail link to Pearson would only make Toronto Island Airport redundant? Pearson has the facilities why not maximize them? So you can save some suit 5 minutes of travel time? Its not going to make that big an impact on Toronto's financial sector.

*c*
 
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