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Sharon warns Palestinians on peace plan

man_slut

TRIBE Member
Sharon warns Palestinians on peace plan
Thursday, December 18, 2003 Posted: 1952 GMT ( 3:52 AM HKT)
http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/18/sharon.speech/index.html

Sharon says Israel will implement a disengagement plan if Palestinians do not take steps to fight terrorism.

HERZLIYA, Israel (CNN) -- Israel will begin to separate itself from the Palestinians if the Palestinian side does not meet its responsibilities under the road map for Middle East peace within several months, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said Thursday.

This "disengagement procedure," to be pursued "in maximum coordination with the United States," would include moving some Israeli settlements, drawing new security lines and altering the deployment of Israeli forces, Sharon said at a security conference in Herzliya, Israel. It would not create a final border, he said.

The road map -- backed by the United States, United Nations, European Union and Russia -- calls for a sequence of security, economic and political steps leading to an independent Palestine by 2005.

If Israel were to disengage, Palestinians would get substantially less than what they could negotiate through the road-map procedure, Sharon said.

The unilateral "disengagement" would be aimed at reducing terrorism and increasing security for Israelis while creating "minimum friction" with Palestinians.

Complaining that Palestinian leaders have failed to stop the terrorist attacks against Israelis, Sharon said, "We do not intend to simply provide Israeli society as a kind of hostage to Palestinians. We will not wait forever for them."

Under disengagement, "the number of Israelis in the midst of the Palestinian population will be reduced to a minimum," he said. "Those communities that will be relocated will in any future arrangement and settlement not be included in Israeli territory."

Palestinian and U.S. officials expressed concerns about the idea of Israel taking unilateral steps rather than strictly following the road map.

Chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erakat told CNN that Israel should stick to the procedures in the road map, saying if it does, it will find a willing partner on the Palestinian side. "The road of dictation is a unilateral road -- and that's what this Israeli government has done since March 2001," he said.

Sharon, in his speech, said Israel remains fully committed to the road map. "It is vital to take every single step we can to lead to the settlement of differences with the Palestinians," he said.

"We are prepared to forge on with implementing it. ... The government will not spare any effort to put the plan into practice .. if the Palestinians do their part -- that is, to see the ousting of every single phenomenon of terrorism, because terrorism and peace do not go hand in hand."

These two statements worry me:

This "disengagement procedure," to be pursued "in maximum coordination with the United States," would include moving some Israeli settlements, drawing new security lines and altering the deployment of Israeli forces, Sharon said at a security conference in Herzliya, Israel. It would not create a final border, he said.
If Israel were to disengage, Palestinians would get substantially less than what they could negotiate through the road-map procedure, Sharon said.
 

bambam

TRIBE Member
Id say this is a good thing. Anyone familiar with the Oslo accords will tell you that the 'peace process' largely constitutes Israel recognising the Palestinian Authority, specifically Arafat, as the representative of the Palestinian people, while offering no guarantees or basic rights, or any recognition of encroachment on Palestinian land since 1947. If youre interested in this, check out Edward Said's Oslo and After: The End of the Peace Process, and anything by Eqbal Ahmad.
Its about time the peace prcess was abandoned so that the situation can be reassessed. There can be no peace process when the Palestinians and the Arab community have never done their homework before sitting down at the negotiating table. Meanwhile, Palestinians are subject to a slew of restrictions hampering travel trade and transport between palestinian cities and towns, and militant israeli settlements on what is supposed to be palestinian land continue to grow unchecked.
These considerations dont even begin to take into account the fact that there can be no peace without gun control.
There is also the question of terrorism. Not once has a definition of terrorism been mentioned which inludes any consideration of cause. After all, killing innocent civilians is a pretty crazy, fucked up thing to do, and the international community should be looking into why these people are so crazy and fucked up that they would commit such acts. Its a widely accepted belief that men who are abused by their fathers will abuse their sons. So hypothetically, terrorists are the most disenfrachised, helpless people on earth. It must be believed that an individual or group will only consider such extreme measures as terrorism when they are utterly convinced that their point of view/ complaints / grievances will not be heard otherwise. To believe otherwise would mean believing that the world is populated by crazy genocidal maniacs. And that is both naive, superficial, immature, and scary
 

~atp~

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by bambam
Id say this is a good thing. Anyone familiar with the Oslo accords will tell you that the 'peace process' largely constitutes Israel recognising the Palestinian Authority, specifically Arafat, as the representative of the Palestinian people, while offering no guarantees or basic rights, or any recognition of encroachment on Palestinian land since 1947. If youre interested in this, check out Edward Said's Oslo and After: The End of the Peace Process, and anything by Eqbal Ahmad.
Its about time the peace prcess was abandoned so that the situation can be reassessed. There can be no peace process when the Palestinians and the Arab community have never done their homework before sitting down at the negotiating table. Meanwhile, Palestinians are subject to a slew of restrictions hampering travel trade and transport between palestinian cities and towns, and militant israeli settlements on what is supposed to be palestinian land continue to grow unchecked.
These considerations dont even begin to take into account the fact that there can be no peace without gun control.
There is also the question of terrorism. Not once has a definition of terrorism been mentioned which inludes any consideration of cause. After all, killing innocent civilians is a pretty crazy, fucked up thing to do, and the international community should be looking into why these people are so crazy and fucked up that they would commit such acts. Its a widely accepted belief that men who are abused by their fathers will abuse their sons. So hypothetically, terrorists are the most disenfrachised, helpless people on earth. It must be believed that an individual or group will only consider such extreme measures as terrorism when they are utterly convinced that their point of view/ complaints / grievances will not be heard otherwise. To believe otherwise would mean believing that the world is populated by crazy genocidal maniacs. And that is both naive, superficial, immature, and scary
 

Deep_Groove

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by bambam
It must be believed that an individual or group will only consider such extreme measures as terrorism when they are utterly convinced that their point of view/ complaints / grievances will not be heard otherwise. To believe otherwise would mean believing that the world is populated by crazy genocidal maniacs. And that is both naive, superficial, immature, and scary
No, what is naive is your faith in human rationality, and your belief that it exists in a similar form in all cultures and peoples.

Need you be reminded that the entire German nation basically went crazy in the years 1939-1945 while committing the genocide of millions, under the influence of some totally extreme mystical racial theories that seem ridiculous to us today.

Or perhaps not so ridiculous, as these were nearly identical theories to what is taught, LITERALLY AS GOSPEL, in every single mosque and school in the Palestinian territories today. This is a fact documented countless times; I don't need to repeat it here. But imagine what kind of mind a young man would have after a lifetime of growing up with that.

You believe the things you want to believe about Palestinian society only because you are incapable - growing up comfortable and secular in the West as you have - of truly understanding the power of fundamentalist religious convictions that drive these incomprehensible acts of mass murder.

---

And regarding the Sharon plan, let me get this straight:

The Palestinians scream day and night about occupation.

Barak negotiates with their "legitimate representatives" at Camp David in 2000 and gives them virtually everything they ask for - everything they can ever realistically hope to get - and their "legitimate representatives" walk out and launch a terrorist war.

So we're supposed to blame Sharon for thinking that negotiations are not the answer and deciding to END THE OCCUPATION?

He says he's going to END the occupation that is supposedly the CAUSE of all the problems, and THAT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH?

Can I be excused if I say [SIZE=18-]WTF?[/SIZE]

- Deep_Groove
 
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