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setting the standard


TRIBE Member
I'd like to touch on a topic that i've been bent about for quite some time.

Originally posted by GrooveGirl

* The UK isn't the only place in the world that has the ability to create music.

Finally sumone else who realizes this!!!

No Offence to anyone... but you ALL say Toronto has the ability to reach international status.... This is correct.

But how do you ever expect to get to that level if we're CONSTANTLY playing follow the leader with the UK?

Nobody ever became a pioneer or set a new standard by following in the foot steps of others.... yet whenever the UK says somethings cool or the new thing we follow like lost sheep.

Im not knocking anyones ideas or anything but if Toronto wants to succeed and gain international recongnition we need to be NEW and creative... set down a new path and stick to it, do what WE want... not what the UK tells us.

Canada and more locally the GTA has the talent, we've got the dj's, we've got the producers. Theres no question in that.

The problem is, (and ive seen it) When sumone does something different or new they get flak from others saying "thats not what the UK wants". Maybe im out on a limb here but once again... How do we expect do get anywhere with an attitude like that?

It gets frustrating hearing that we need to impress the UK and we need to keep up with them.

How did the UK get to be where they are? How did they obtain the ability to tell us what goes?
Simple.... They were different... they were pioneers and they didnt follow.

Have you ever notcied that were continually playing catch up with the UK? Everytime we start to gain a little weight in a genre they move on to something else.
How do we plan on breaking that trend?
Do we plan on breaking that trend?

The UK sets the trend not only with their talent but with their attitude... they dont give a shit, they know their at the top and nobody will ever challenge.

Confidence breeds success. Following in the footsteps is not confidence.

Just a thought.



TRIBE Member

the stuff coming out of canada right now is doing extremely well - look at melting man's red skull or jelo's dirty thumper remixes, both of which are getting huge plugs in the uk.......theres a reason for this, and that is that artists who work within local environments across the globe know that the only difference between where they are and the UK is press/media/popular acceptance....to be totally honest, even if there weren't a smaller degree of differentiation between popular music/dance music in the UK, most of the same artists doing what they would be doing (for the most part) the same things they are.
Dance music MAY be more underground here in canada, but im proud to be in the midst of the artists im around, if only because i know that they are following the same type of dream that is being followed overseas, albiet without AS much public recognition.


TRIBE Member
only difference between where they are and the UK is press/media/popular acceptance

exactly. there's lots of talent here in canada but unfortunately not enough support for it. in the UK, people are fanatic about new music. it's like a machine that just pumps out tons and tons of stuff and everyone likes to go out and hear it. in canada, you have to take it somewhere else to get that support. so it makes it significantly tougher to make a name for yourself at home. it also makes it extremely difficult for innovative artists trying new things to get any recognition without taking their music to other places first.

historically, the uk has always been on top of their game for creating new kinds of music. i don't really see canada as ever being a trend-setter in music simply because we don't have what it takes to support it at home. again, that doesn't mean that we don't have talented producers, there's just not enough concentration of activity.

i gotta admit though that the one exception to this seems to be toronto's drum n' bass scene.

Angus Robinson

TRIBE Member
Originally posted by funkNstyle
Nobody ever became a pioneer or set a new standard by following in the foot steps of others.... yet whenever the UK says somethings cool or the new thing we follow like lost sheep.

Don't you think it's also possible that some of us might actually like some of the new stuff coming out of the UK for it's musical quality, not just cuz it's the new thing?

Another thing...

I was hanging out with Hatiras this summer at my friend's cottage, and I had a long conversation with him on this topic. I was telling him that I planned on producing in the future, and he gave me some really good advice, which I will pass on to you. He said that when you are first starting out, don't do anything too crazy. Create music which is quite similar to what is really popular at the moment. Do that for your first few releases until you build up a bit of a name for yourself. Once you have been accepted and have gained credibility, you have more freedom to gradually change things around a bit and hit the masses with crazier/less-mainstream stuff. When I start producing (not just foolin around...) that's the approach I am going to take.


TRIBE Member
If u read my post correctly Angus you'd see that i never said i dis-liked it all.
Just like in my Soul thread.
I said i like alot of the new stuff commin out, but i dis-like quite a bit too.

To each their own.

My point is that if everyones keeps doin what the UK tells us we'll never get to international status.
And there is no valid arguement against that.

The conversation you had with Hatiras has good points but once again its missing the point of being a leader.

If u continue to create what the UK tells you, even after you've distinguished a name for yourself you'll never been a pioneer.
Im cool with those who create the same old, in order to get a name for yourself but makin music has one purpose... To take the music to another level not to be copied or imitated several times over.

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In the last issue of Knowlegde(UK dnb/breaks mag) there's an article on the jungle scene here in Toronto. They mention that the jungle scene here is amazing and they were commenting on the fact that there is a night almost every day of the week.

A few issues ago they had the winners of their Knowledge awards, and Vinyl Syndicate won for best international label.

So toronto has been getting recognition in the UK, just not for breaks....YET.