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Russian Homophobia and generalized propaganda

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
Hey reader,

Many of you hate me so just read this if nothing else:

Opinion: Make Olympics in Russia the gayest ever - CNN.com

Knowing the majority of people reading this are straight, I encourage for a moment for you to take a "time out", to imagine how it must be, for those of us who do not meet cultural norms.

I say "cultural norms" because naturally and evolutionarily gay people, animals, worms, etc. all exist and it is a fundamentally benefit somehow. How? Seems like no one knows, yet, but it must be valuable otherwise everyone would be straight. I have a theory and there are many others available online.

Returning to the original point of posting, I am highly dissatisfied with Russia and it's approach to homosexuality. Russia, in the post-soviet era, wants to be included, or respected, as a progressive society. Yet, we clearly don't see any progress from Putin, or Medvelelele his puppet, and even in any Russians, I don't see any homophilia. It's a backwards nation that failed many times, and frankly, I'm tired of hearing, albeit intelligent Russians, try to back up their corrupt indeveloped nonsense state.

Interestingly enough these are all Russians who, for whatever reason unbeknownst to me, decided it was better to evacuate Russia and live in USA or Canada, than to stay in Russia.

-jM
A&D
 

DJ_Science

TRIBE Member
I say "cultural norms" because naturally and evolutionarily gay people, animals, worms, etc. all exist and it is a fundamentally benefit somehow. How? Seems like no one knows, yet, but it must be valuable otherwise everyone would be straight. I have a theory and there are many others available online.
There's actually quite a large amount of scientific literature on the subject.
 
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acheron

TRIBE Member
We can hardly expect an extremely backward nation to update itself to our so-called moral standard in a mere 25 years of democracy, which it should be said is on very shaky ground in Russia at the moment under Putin. And for that matter, who are we to be making demands when homosexuality is hardly a settled issue even in our own countries.
 

MoFo

TRIBE Member
This could be a Gay Spring! Or a bunch of people are gonna die and be killed and nothing will be done because no one cares about gay people.
 
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Krzysiu

TRIBE Member
I have a couple questions due to being ill-informed on the subject of sexual tolerance in the former Soviet Union (Hey, when oppressing, get painted the oppressor!) - why is this becoming front page now, what has changed to make the world aware of the persecution of gays in Russia?

Is this caused of some sort've social need to take frustrations of their current quality of living out on a scapegoat and am easy targeted minority such as same-sex relations?

Is this a result of conservative political figures? Isn't Putin on the ritz? - those tiger photos - come on!

Has it always been this way for homosexuality in Russia? Or is this a worsening development?

Was Pussy Riot ever freed?
 

kyfe

TRIBE Member
We can hardly expect an extremely backward nation to update itself to our so-called moral standard in a mere 25 years of democracy, which it should be said is on very shaky ground in Russia at the moment under Putin. And for that matter, who are we to be making demands when homosexuality is hardly a settled issue even in our own countries.
what is going on in Russia is not just a gay/straight issue, it's becoming a humanitarian issue. People are being stalked online, targeted, then assaulted, rapped and/or murdered.

While I am aware this happens in Canada it is still something our government and our people defend against, in Russia they are being specifically sought out and vilified by almost the entire nation. As a member of the united nations is the country that extremely backwards?
 

MoFo

TRIBE Member
And they recently finalized the gay propaganda law. So it wasn't technically illegal to be gay but now it is official. So the law protects people like Neo Nazis who are doing the assaulting and torturing.
 

janiecakes

TRIBE Member
I have a couple questions due to being ill-informed on the subject of sexual tolerance in the former Soviet Union (Hey, when oppressing, get painted the oppressor!) - why is this becoming front page now, what has changed to make the world aware of the persecution of gays in Russia?

Is this caused of some sort've social need to take frustrations of their current quality of living out on a scapegoat and am easy targeted minority such as same-sex relations?

Is this a result of conservative political figures? Isn't Putin on the ritz? - those tiger photos - come on!

Has it always been this way for homosexuality in Russia? Or is this a worsening development?

Was Pussy Riot ever freed?
- it's front page news because of a few laws recently passed and because of the upcoming olympics. One law bans adopting out Russian babies to gay couples, or to any couple in any country with marriage equality. Another, the "gay propaganda" law that has been in the news a lot, criminalizes pro-gay speech or actions (wearing rainbow flags, holding hands in public, etc) and allows Russia to detain tourists for 2 weeks before returning them to their home country. This prompted travel advisories people started asking 'what is going to happen to gay olympic athletes?' and that's what got it into the news.

- Things have been up and down for queers in Russia, mostly down. Being gay was decriminalized in the early 90s, but the social climate was not exactly supportive. Info on LGBT history in Russia: LGBT history in Russia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(- one woman from Pussy Riot is out and the other two were just denied parole.)
 

acheron

TRIBE Member
I totally agree that the more progressive nations of the world have a responsibility to criticize Russia for its treatment of homosexuals and others. That said, Russia is only one of many nations that treat homosexuals this way, or threaten to. Russia is very big and powerful and governments have to be careful when criticizing the policies and morality of countries they trade with. Russia is big enough that it can effectively say, "no." when someone asks them to do something, and we really can't do anything about it. We just have to keep pressing. It will take a very long time for Russia to come around on this - the reddit post I linked to has a very good explanation why it will take a long time. Russia is still very much in flux post-communism and it is a very fragile society. They are dealing with economic issues, wars, religious freedom, politics, sexuality, capitalism, freedom of the press, digital media, etc all at once.
 
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kyfe

TRIBE Member
I am sick to the stomach from just glancing at kyfe's link. Sick to the stomach. ... :(
I originally gave it it's own link in the hopes it wouldn't get lost in the rest of the discussion in this thread. Apparently the topic is to close to this subject to warrant it's own thread

you know SEO Web search optimization blah blah blah

I felt the same as you having read that article it's sad to think that someone could do that to someone else in today's society. probably left over children from the KGB era.
 

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
As was mentioned, the reason this is getting attention now is a confluence of issues.

Firstly, the passing of bizarrely weird laws clearly intended to give police an open net against regular gay people (using the age old wash "think of the children!")

The fact that the law came out so close to the olympics is almost certainly coincidental, but nonetheless, the highlight here is that Russia, like nazi Germany, isn't exactly a model society.

And then, in a more general sense, there's something strange brewing in Russia, if you believe the statistics quoted. In complete contradiction to, well, almost the entire world, Russia is one of the few places where militant homophobia is actually on the rise... What does this say about the Russian people in general? Homosexual issues aside, what does it say about a people who respond so eagerly to propaganda and state-run mind-missions?

-jM
A&D
 
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MrMarcus

TRIBE Member
Post v. Putin Over Gay Agenda

Our moral and cultural elites have put Putin on notice: Get in step with us on homosexual rights—or we may just boycott your Sochi games.

What this reveals is the distance America has traveled, morally and culturally, in a few short years, and our amnesia about who we Americans once were, and what it is we once believed.

Only yesterday, homosexual sodomy, which Thomas Jefferson said should be treated like rape, was outlawed in many states and same-sex marriage was regarded as an absurdity.

Was that America we grew up in really like Nazi Germany?
Plus, I think maybe Obama's pissed off at Putin over the Snowden thing.
 

praktik

TRIBE Member
Ya Pat Buchanan still hits the same notes, over and over and over and over and over

He makes the McLaughlin group a bit more interesting though...

byyyye BYE!
 

soulmantra

TRIBE Member
I'm thinking that when Russia was awarded the games in the first place... maybe about 0% of us would have considered them a suitable host country for the ideals the Olympics are supposed to uphold.

Having said that... Canada probably doesn't fair too well either, if we are honest with ourselves.

Also I've been to Russia and the people are for the most part just as caring and compassionate as anywhere else...but being under the threat of real harm they will agree to things most people would agree to... to protect their family, themselves, etc. It's pretty hard to judge and say, "Russians are this, or that."
 
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Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
Why do I continue to post here?

Maybe it's cathartic for me, somehow.

My friend from Russia came over to talk to me. By came over, I'm talking airplanes and limousines, not gentle walks through the park.

But even he couldn't help me out very much. So I phoned the most beautiful boy I know, and I was thinking:

Jeff> "Well if a handsome boy like this can't cheer me up then, what can?"

I heard a very upsetting story in the meanwhile.

And then I took several taxis, looking for a Catholic church that was open on a sunday., I interrupted a service, sort of, and however found the priest, eventually, and gave what I was considering to be my last confession.

We did a prayer, we bowed, and I left.

Well this morning I woke up with two hospital wristbands, one on each hand.

A kind gentleman I knew from grade school signed my form ! and said:

David> "What happened Jeff?"
me> "I'm not really sure, but it seems that you have a better answer than me."

-jM
A&D
 
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