Ravers & Depression

[Brite]

I find the correlation between ravers and depression astoundingly high.
Is it due to the drugs?
Is it that people who are depressed seek out something to be a part of and find the rave scene?
Or is it simply coincidence but ravers tend to be more open about their depression?

I often have noticed (not as much on this board) that so many people suffer from a form of depression and also rave.
drugs- Are people with depression educated enough about their disease to know that prozake blocks their reuptake (sp?) of seratonin, so taking E that has simliarly the same affects inevitable comes to a haltering crash. K is a anestetic, that is classified as a 'disassociative,' and studies are now being done that say it's psychological consquences are the person developing a new sense of self (fantasies of grandeur are often reported). Crystal, I am not as versed on but I am aware the affects of coming down are not benefical for people who are already low on themseleves. My point being these drugs don't help the depression (obviously) but do they help create it? People who are genetically vulnerable to certain disorders may be pushing themselves closer to developing it but using.
finding a way to belong- the scene began as a bunch of people who didn't fit in the mainstream starting a community of acceptence and eventually the motto of PLUR was born. Obviously, PLUR and it's ideas have been distorted and lost on some, over the years but is the scene's original roots in the 'outsiders' still apply? Do people with depresion tend to exclude themselves from the mainstream and find solace in the rave community?
coincidence(sp?) Do ravers just feel closer to each other because it's a tight community, therefore share their expierences with depression easier? Is it just mere coincidence that a large percentage is depressed?

I'm curious as to what you guys think.

 

[PosTMOd]

Selection bias.

 

[Bass-Invader]

no, there is just a correlation between teenagers and depression.

unless it's sunday.

 

[ninja]

I agree with bass invader...
sure everyone has thier sketchy sunday... but I think most people know the consiquences fr doing drugs of that nature. yes I think drugs cause temporary depression becasue of the chemical imbalence created in the brain but serious more long term depression (which is what I think your talking about above brite) I have to dissagree

 

[deep]

Chicken or the egg issue...drugs do have an impact on subsequent emotional functioning but as well I think certain types of personalities are drawn to chemical experimentation in the first place. I think on a certain level anyone who does any kind of chemical is engaging in some degree of escapism from every day life. As well, I do think that once you've taken drugs and redefined the boundaries of your emotional spectrum it is more difficult to reconcile the comparatively more subtle stimuli found in every day life. I.E. non party people don't get depressed at how mundane every day life is because they don't have a drug state to compare things to - a cognitive hallmark of depression is feeling as though things are not as good as they could be and not being able to accept the way that they are.

As well I think with some poeple drugs can become a crutch to prevent them from developing the emotional skills they need to. For example people often resort to alcohol rather than developing constructive coping mechanisms to negativity in their life. I'm not demonizing drugs by any means - I'm a big fan of chemical experimentation - rather that there are issues that people often don't become aware of until it's too late.

 

[dimpy]

very well said deep,

i usually see sketchy sundays as an inevitable part of being up, but i see them as a chance for reflection. i'm always cautious of my perception of reality becoming too out whack after taking any kind of substance.

more to come...

 

[Rosey]

Originally posted by deep
Chicken or the egg issue...

deep, look, come-on man! obviously the egg from which the first chicked was hatched was layed by some evolutionary predecessor to the chicken, a proto-chicken (or as i like to call it, a chockan). thus the first egg containing a chicken existed before the chicken, proginy of the chockan, existed as a distinct entity.

 

[deep]

Originally posted by Rosey


deep, look, come-on man! obviously the egg from which the first chicked was hatched was layed by some evolutionary predecessor to the chicken, a proto-chicken (or as i like to call it, a chockan). thus the first egg containing a chicken existed before the chicken, proginy of the chockan, existed as a distinct entity.

protochickens = lizards

I prefer protoclown to protochickens though.

 

[Guest]

Originally posted by deep
I.E. non party people don't get depressed at how mundane every day life is because they don't have a drug state to compare things to

This is a great point, albeit paraphrased from a conversation I was having with Simon earlier tonight.

But I digress, and I agree, that when a state of euphoria is acheived (as can be the case at raves and other drug-induced locales) the following mundane activity of everyday life does become insignificant. When something becomes meaningless as such, the brain's stimulants cease to function at a reasonable capacity, and the void of depression becomes inevitable.

In other words, when you reach the peak of Everest, where do you go to climb higher?

I lernt some big words one time ago.

 

[Rosey]

personally, although i suffered from mood swings that were somewhat dramatic when i first started regularly using party drugs, now that i only use occasionally i am far less prone to depression than i was pre-usuage.

 

[deep]

Originally posted by Tearer


This is a great point, albeit paraphrased from a conversation I was having with Simon earlier tonight.

Simon probably stole it from me, like my prized dildo.

Do depressed people gravitate towards the excesses of the party scene, or do the excesses of the party scene induce depression? I don't think the causal relationship is unidirectional but bidirectional, much like many people on E suddenly become bisexual and not unisexual.

PS. I don't really have a dildo.

 

[Rosey]

or, to paraphrase high fidelity:

did listening to electronic music make me depressed? or did i listen to electronic music because i was depressed?

alternate wording being: "did i do drugs because i liked electronic music? or did i like electronic music because i did drugs?"

it's another chockan or the lizard question?

 

[deep]

CLOWN SMASH!!!!!!!

 

[mandapanda]

i am 10 times LESS depressed than in my "pre-partying" days. but it is difficult to pinpoint what the cause of this is, as it could be completely unrelated and more to do with getting rid of that horrible clicheed teen angst....

hard to tell, innit?


of course, as always, moderation is key. i'm pretty sure if i was caning in 7 nights a week, my mental health would in a frightening state.

 

[deep]

Originally posted by mandapanda
caning

lol

 

[Cheer Bear]

Partying helped my depression. Until I realized that I was just running away from it to begin with. That included drugs, alcohol, not talking to anyone about what I was feeling....etc.

It DID help me make many changes, due to some very special people.

I don't think I would've done it without their help.

So in some ways, it was bad, in other ways in was very VERY good.

 

[mingster]

They say (and no, I don't know who they are), that 1 in 10 canadians suffers from depression, on different levels of course. Sounds about right to me.

I'm inclined to think that all kinds of people get depressed and that the numbers are spread out pretty evenly. I don't think being depressed is something that would occur more often in ravers. And I believe that there is a difference between suffering the Sketchy Sundays, having low seratonin & actually being depressed.

But I do think that people who have experimented with their emotions and mental potential are more likely to be in touch and able to discuss their feelings, and consequently their sadness and apathy. I guess one might say that "Ravers" and the like have traditionally been more open to discussion about these things. But I think you will find this is many circles where people are into the journey of themselves. Does drugs help with this? Some might say yes. Others might argue that drugs do the complete opposite. Myself? I'm likely to think that the solution lies somewhere in between.

Ming.

 

[nusty]

Personally I just have such a great life from parties and meeting the nicest people found anywhere that when the rest of life seems not as good and causes me to feel a bit depressed from time to time. I find most other areas of life hard pressed to measure up against what I've experienced through the electronic music scene. Things with my family are good but I only see them three times a year if i'm lucky so that kind of sucks. I also live in a basement room and have next to no sunlight during the week but that's a side note.

 

[ninja]

on a somewhat related note,,,
me roommate here in BC suffers from depression and was put on an anti-depressant, Paxill or something Im not sure the exact name but since she has taken alot of E in her day it reacted with her since her seritonin receptors absorb the effects of it too quickly and it reversed the effect...
so that might have something to do with the topic but it doesnt answer if the Drugs caused her depression...hmmm I think not.

 

[AdamAnt]

I normally don't post anything in a thread that Deep has posted in. What's the point?

Ditto.

 

[Rosey]

Originally posted by Rosey

it's another chockan or the lizard question?

24 hours pass and not a single comment about choking the lizard? i'm dissapointed in you tribe. very disappointed.

 

[PosTMOd]

Might be a good time to point out a couple of things:

1) It's SEROTONIN, not any of those wacky derivative spellings... [pet peeve, sorry]

2) If you are taking anti-depressants, DO NOT take MDMA. Paxil, Prozac, and other SSRIs (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors) block the little pumps that cycle serotonin back into the neuron... this little pump is highly involved in MDMA's action, so you will only get crappy effects (if not dangerous effects) from MDMA if you are on an SSRI. Other anti-depressants, e.g. MAO inhibitors, are dangerous as fuck to take with MDMA.

3) If you do take MDMA, you can reduce your neurotoxicity substantially by taking an SSRI (Paxil, Prozac, etc.) within 6 hours of dosing. SSRIs (as mentioned above) block the little pump that MDMA jams open [theoretically]... you don't want that pump open in the wee hours of the morning after dosing, or dopamine decides to go in and cause hell.

 

[QueenOfSwords]

E and depression...

For me, personally, it's been a cycle that I've had some trouble escaping.

I would feel that life had disappointed me, and I'd do a pill to have fun and forget about life stresses...but the resulting low serotonin would make regular day to day life comparably mundane and hard to deal with...resulting in taking another pill to deal with things...

Do I think that pills caused the problem? No. I was finding life difficult in the first place -- drugs just aggravated it. And I can't prove that the chemical imbalances in my brain NOW weren't caused by my excessive drug use THEN...I just don't know.

I have also experienced problems with K though, far moreso than E. I found K to be extremely psychologically addictive...I forget all about how inferior I might have felt otherwise when I'm on K.

I don't knock anyone for using these things...but I really believe that if you're having problems in the first place, the possibility to spiral out of control, and to completely trash your brain, is very real.

B.

 

[BigBadBaldy]

I'm more traditional. I get depressed because of LIFE, and take drugs to alleviate said depression momentarily.

BBB.

When the drugs start depressing you, it's time to stop doing them. Hint hint. Whon Whon.

 

[Pyrovitae]

sorry i'm late, i was choking the lizard...

i would agree that there's a correlation between drug use/party kids/depression, but that could just be selective sampling of the population. here's my story:

i got into the scene.
i started doing drugs.
i started feeling really bad.
i was diagnosed with a mental disorder. (which i think previously existed and was just exacerbated by my drug experimentation.)
i was put on ssri's.
i stopped doing drugs. (for awhile.)
i grew up & matured.
i stopped taking ssri's.
i learned to cope on my own.
now i'm a positive, "normal" contributing member of society.

*the end*

i think deep expressed it pretty well. and mao was cool.

*muah*
~N