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Property Tax WTF!

Discussion in 'TRIBE Main Forum' started by vveerrgg, Oct 18, 2005.

  1. vveerrgg

    vveerrgg TRIBE Promoter

    Anyone else get a nice little suprise in the mail?

    My property taxes went up 37%.

    WTF!.... God damn Mpac! I'm getting my place re assessed.

    Not the best way to start a day thats for sure! fuckin hell!
  2. daddyiwantchocolate

    daddyiwantchocolate TRIBE Member

    That's nothing, I've seen places go up 50%+.
    Oh, and by the way, the assessment will get you nowhere other than run around in circles to hear the same thing.
  3. basketballjones

    basketballjones TRIBE Member

    i used to sell reassments by telemarketing, i didnt last long cause my heart wasnt in it...HA
  4. acheron

    acheron TRIBE Member

    Got mine today. 15.68% increase... average for City of Toronto was 11 point something.
  5. Klubmasta Will

    Klubmasta Will TRIBE Member

    mine went up 23%.

    i would complain but, really, it's in response to property value going up, so i can't complain too much. still, they have pegged my unit at a value that would be aggressive for any seller, so i was debating doing something about it.
  6. coleridge

    coleridge TRIBE Member

    Yesterday's mail was Reassessment ... not Property Taxes. Your property taxes might not necessarily go up as much.

    Is this your first reassessment on a brand new dwelling? They go up a lot first year.
  7. coleridge

    coleridge TRIBE Member

    Generally speaking I thought assessed values should be lower than market value?
  8. acheron

    acheron TRIBE Member

    The assessment we got is about $20,000 higher than my bank put the value of our home at about a year ago, so that's progress at any rate... We shall see what happens when we get our new property tax bill.
  9. Klubmasta Will

    Klubmasta Will TRIBE Member

    that's normally the case, but i think MPAC has been trying to rectify that by using the 'current value assessment' method. here's the description in the MPAC faq:

    How are assessments established?

    The Assessment Act requires that your property’s assessed value be based on what it would likely have sold for on a specific date. For the 2005 taxation year, that date is June 30, 2003 (the same valuation date used for the 2004 taxation year). For the 2006 taxation year, that valuation date will be January 1, 2005.

    To establish your property’s assessed value, MPAC analyzes property sales in your area. These sales provide a basis for the assessed values of similar properties. MPAC continually collects information about properties to ensure that those with similar features (age, size, location, construction, etc.) have similar assessed values.

    This method, called current value assessment, is used by most assessment jurisdictions in Canada and throughout the world

    How does this Notice relate to my property taxes?

    Your municipality will determine and apply tax rates to the assessment of each property according to its tax class. There are seven main tax classes: residential, multi-residential, commercial, industrial, pipe line, farm and managed forests. Each tax class may have its own tax rate. The Province sets the education tax rates for all properties.

    municipal tax rate x current value assessment = municipal portion of tax

    education tax rate x current value assessment = education portion of tax

    municipal portion of tax + education portion of tax = your property taxes

    It is important to note that the total amount of taxes collected by your municipality depends on the municipality’s revenue needs, not on the relative value of property assessments within a municipality. The value of properties determines how the tax burden is shared between property owners.

    How will this Notice affect me?

    The value shown on your Notice may result in a change in your property taxes in 2005, or it may have no effect at all. Your taxes are affected by a number of factors.

    For example:

    * Has the value of your property changed as a result of new construction or an Assessment Review Board adjustment?
    * Has there been a change to your property’s classification?
    * Does your municipality require more or less revenue than in previous tax years to deliver expected services?

    How does my assessed value work for me?

    Accurate property assessment is the basis for property taxation and ensures everyone in your community pays their share of property taxes. You want your assessed value to be accurate.
    So do we.

    How do I know if my property’s assessed value is accurate?

    Ask yourself:

    * Does your assessed value reflect what you would have expected to sell your property for in June 2003? If the answer is yes, then this is a good indication that the assessed value is accurate.
    * Does your assessed value reflect what other similar properties were selling for at that time? If the answer is yes, then this is a good indication that the assessed value is accurate.

    A single sale does not necessarily determine the value for a property, or for all properties within a neighbourhood. All sales in the area are considered when establishing the assessed value.

    What can I do if I disagree with this Notice?

    1. Contact us

    We are here to answer your questions. If the information (e.g. property details, school support designation) on your Notice is incorrect, please contact us toll free at 1 866 296-MPAC (6722) to verify details about your property.

    If you have Internet access, you may also want to access assessment information through AboutMyPropertyâ„¢ on our web site, www.mpac.ca.

    2. Ask MPAC to review your assessment

    If you believe your assessment is incorrect, we will be pleased to review the assessment through a Request for Reconsideration (RfR). There is no fee for this review and your request can be made any time before December 31, 2005.

    RfR forms are available on our web site (www.mpac.ca), or by calling us toll free at 1 866 296-MPAC (6722). You may also write a letter requesting a review of your assessment. Please include the following information in your letter:

    * 19-digit roll number;
    * your full name, address and phone number; and
    * all the reasons why you feel your assessment is incorrect (i.e. include examples).

    The more details about your property that you provide, the quicker and easier it is for us to perform a review on your behalf.

    3. File a Notice of Complaint if you still disagree with your assessment

    Another option is to file a Notice of Complaint with the Assessment Review Board (ARB) by March 31, 2005. The ARB is an independent tribunal of the Province of Ontario. Both the property owner and MPAC will be asked to appear at a hearing to present evidence to support their arguments.

    There are specific application forms and fees with this approach. A complaint can be launched (provided it is submitted by March 31, 2005) before, during, or after an RfR has been submitted and will be withdrawn if an RfR successfully deals with your concerns prior to a complaint hearing. In addition, an RfR will not be processed if a complaint has been heard by the ARB.

    If you file both an RfR and a Notice of Complaint, Ontario Regulation 175/99 (as amended by O.Reg. 320/01) allows the ARB to refund your filing fee provided the following three criteria are met:

    * Your RfR is filed with MPAC before your Notice of Complaint is filed with the ARB; and
    * The issue is settled through the RfR process after the Notice of Complaint is filed; and
    * The ARB complaint is withdrawn before the start of the hearing.

    If you choose not to file a Notice of Complaint with the ARB, MPAC’s decision is final. Your next opportunity to have your assessment reviewed will be for the 2006 taxation year.

    Assessment complaints for the 2004 taxation year, which are not resolved before the complaint deadline (March 31, 2005), will be considered for the 2005 taxation year.

    To find out more about assessment complaints please visit the ARB’s web site at www.arb.gov.on.ca, or call their toll free number at 1 800 263-3237 or 416 314-6900.
  10. kuba

    kuba TRIBE Member

    yeah, I got mine in the mail also... I also didn't think this was a final assessment / rise, just an assessment of the values etc. and how it might impact my taxes...
  11. rejenerate

    rejenerate TRIBE Member

    Re: Re: Property Tax WTF!

    What he said. The mailing says that your taxes may not actually go up.
  12. Skipper

    Skipper TRIBE Member

    Whereabouts do you live verg?
  13. KillaLadY

    KillaLadY TRIBE Member

    I am afraid to open the envelope.
  14. kuba

    kuba TRIBE Member

    He, I, and alex are in leslieville.
  15. coleridge

    coleridge TRIBE Member

    Well I guess it's good for us then as ours came in moderately lower than it's market value. Still a big jump around 20%.
  16. Klubmasta Will

    Klubmasta Will TRIBE Member

    Re: Re: Re: Property Tax WTF!

    your property tax is based on a simple formula = municipal tax rate x assessed property value

    so, it's true that your taxes MIGHT not go up (i.e. if the municipal tax rate went down for some reason), but i wouldn't bet on it. they probably just put that line in the mailing to stop ppl from freaking out. :p

    if your assessed value went up by, say, 20%, then your property tax would be 20% higher than it would have been had your assessed value remained the same.
  17. kuba

    kuba TRIBE Member

    Damn. from $190 to $260 per month jump.

    (although, as a homeowner, I still kind of agree that with the rising prices of real estate, we have to pay for that SOMEhow, no? buy a house, make $50K on it in 2 years, yet, complain about a $70 per month jump in taxes?)
  18. technowelt

    technowelt TRIBE Member

    now you can complain about city services 37% more!

    i got mine as well. it is sitting at home waiting to be opened.
  19. mcbee

    mcbee TRIBE Member

    mine went up by 7%, so i feel blessed:)

    the value of the property is still less than i'd like it to be tho:(

  20. Re: Shoe

    Re: Shoe TRIBE Member

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Property Tax WTF!

    If a municipal government makes a statement along the lines of "there will be no increase in property taxes this year", are we to assume that only means that the "municipal tax rate" in the above formula remains unchaged, but the tax payable will increase according to the change in the assessed property value?

    In other words, does the city get off saying "no tax increase" by putting the blame on MPAC?

    Given the real estate boom and increase in property values over the last few years, you'd think that the municipal government (governments around the GTA certaintly) are seeing huge increases in revenue from residential property taxes, even if they leave the tax rate totally unchanged.
  21. kuba

    kuba TRIBE Member

    Probably because you own a condo, and those rise the least.


    in that order, from least to most.
  22. alexd

    alexd Administrator Staff Member

    Mine is up 37%

    My assessed value has gone up by over $100,000 in four years. Yikes!
  23. coleridge

    coleridge TRIBE Member

    NO! This is a VERY good thing. :)

    I would like my assessment to be $100.
  24. Vise

    Vise TRIBE Member

    I have a semi at Greenwood/Danforth and my assessment went up 20%. My girlfriend has a detached house around the corner (Coxwell & Gerrard) and her's only went up 5%. Weird.
  25. gollum

    gollum TRIBE Member

    What bothers me is the whole notion that we need to milk every last penny out of people.

    As soon as your property value increases we need more money.

    This forces people who have lived in a location for even 50 years to possibly lose their house because they can't pay taxes.

    This is very noticeable in communities such as Muskoka or Kawartha Lakes (around the lakes).

    Families who have owned cottages or houses on the lake since they were very cheap now have to pay outrageous taxes on their properties solely because stupid rich people are willing to fork over millions of dollars for a piece of property.

    (I'm trying to remember this definition from an article I read years ago)
    There is a push towards something called "fair value assessment". Basically this would base your taxes on what you paid for your house if it was purchased within 3 years. Otherwise your assessment would be based on what you paid when you bought it, but increased based on inflation.

    This allows people who have lived somewhere for years to continue to live there, but as soon as the place is sold the taxes go up.


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