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ODSP, OW, and related filth

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
For those who don't know:

ODSP is a government program that pays out money to keep "disabled" people alive.

OW is an acronym for "Ontario Works" which is the biggest irony I've seen in a decade. You might more commonly know it as "welfare" or "the dole".

Well, how someone with a physical disability is still able to garden, haul wood, and hook, is kinda strange to me.

And how a 23 year old kid is able to collect free money for 4 years without question also kinda, you know, grinds my gears.

Being a slumlord millionaire I see these types come and go all the time. They have no interest in working, ever. They're perfectly capable -- but if you start at 19, transitioning from your mom's cute little cradle to the big scary world, and in both cases some "someone" just is handing you money every month, then there's no bloody way this type of person is ever going to bother with a real job. They find a way to live like sheltered bums to the detriment of the rest of us. Which involves a heavy dose of theft and conniving.

Now, these people aren't the "real" poor. They're physically fit and often times quite sharp. They're just bloodsuckers. And there are so many of them.

Yes, there was a time when I was laid off and had to depend on money. But that was EI money that I paid into for decades.

I guess paying these OW people is just a way to keep them from stealing physically what they'd take anyhow.

-jM
A&D
 

praktik

TRIBE Member
I think the collective impact of freeloading poor people is still less than that of freeloading rich people, in terms of things to worry about.

The "poor people getting a free ride" type talk is one of those "greatest tricks the devil ever pulled" type things, and if I was rich I'd be thrilled to live in a society where the middle classes think more about people getting benefits who aren't supposed to - and those damned unions! - then about how rich people are gaming the system and growing ever wealthier. Middle classes suffer wage stagnation and they look down, not up.
 

Blysspluss

TRIBE Member
It's true...the concentration of wealth is a more raw deal than a minority of folks "gaming the system". The tax havens for high income individuals and corporations is more of a drain on our tax dollars than that shit ever could be.

That said, so is the war on drugs.
 

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
I had a whole long thing written here but I just feel it's pointless.

I do believe in welfare and support for people who need it. It's just, when I see such in-your-face abuse of the system, it pisses me off.

Tell me this: anyone who is 22 years old, has secure shelter (thanks to me), and in perfect health.... WHO in that category "cannot work" so bad that they need Ontario Works for YEARS.

There are so many of them. They'll turn down a better paying job at Tim Horton's in order to sit around and play video games all day on the government dime. When will that change? Which clerk somewhere is supposed to make sure these homeful bums are doing something?

-jM
A&D
 
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Lojack

TRIBE Member
There are so many of them. They'll turn down a better paying job at Tim Horton's in order to sit around and play video games all day on the government dime. When will that change? Which clerk somewhere is supposed to make sure these homeful bums are doing something?
A co-worker just ridded herself of a roommate who does exactly that. Sits home all day smoking pot and playing video games. Will not get a job. Has clinical depression, which is valid, but does not take medication, exercise or eat right, and wonders why it persists. Anyway, she's much happier now that he is gone, but will miss him paying half the rent.
 

Snuffy

TRIBE Member
Well, how someone with a physical disability is still able to garden, haul wood, and hook, is kinda strange to me.
Yes, until he or she has a major mental breakdown in a corporate environment. Mental illness can manifest in ways that don't appear very obvious at first. Had a friend that was bipolar... I don't think he'll ever have the capacity to hold down a steady job.

You take away the support, and people like him end up on the streets.
 

alison87

TRIBE Member
The problem is when the mental illness becomes a crutch, an excuse not to work. Lots of people live with a diagnosed mental illness - our esteemed thread starter and myself included. But we still work. Meanwhile others self-destruct in every job they ever get, blaming it on anxiety or depression or bipolar or whatever. I think there is a certain type of personality who can compartmentalize, who can kick ass at work in spite of the crazy because that's just what needs to be done. Then there is a type who feels the crazy creeping and just goes "meh, that's it for me then". Because disability benefit is there they can afford to do that. Would they be on the street otherwise? Possibly. (More likely they'd be leeching off family and friends.) Either way, because disability benefit is by definition not temporary, there is also no motivation to learn coping mechanisms and maybe get to a point where you can compartmentalize the crazy and become a productive member of society. I think the problem starts with parents coddling their kids and not teaching independence and individual responsibility, but it's exacerbated by a system that tends to ghettoize rather rehabilitate, and the stigma that still exists in "healthy" society.

All that said, i think the number of bludgers on unemployment and disability benefits is really too low to give a shit about. Yeah, they're misusing the system and sucking money out of other services. But there are WAY bigger expenses where our tax dollars are being pissed away (e.g. hand-outs for agriculture, big business, families, home-owners). It's easy to shit on the lazy fucks who aren't working, but it's the ones who are working and still get hand-outs that are the real scam artists.
 

ian

TRIBE Member
It's easy to shit on the lazy fucks who aren't working, but it's the ones who are working and still get hand-outs that are the real scam artists.
Absofuckinglutely. As a society let's worry more about the waste at the top first. That's where the big bucks are being wasted. This nickle and dime stuff that sick and/or lazy people scrabble for can be sorted out later. It's like those strategies financial analysts tells us to get our finances in order. . . pay off your highest interest debt first. Leave the smaller stuff for last.
 
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praktik

TRIBE Member
...and actually it's this kind of talk, a staple of certain news outlets and the recent ideological environment, that actually feeds into our widening inequality by putting the emphasis in the wrong place.

There isn't as much space for us to focus on what really matters when we are distracted by narratives like this. It's certainly part of the framework that ensures elite priorities are preferred over those of the rest of us.
 

Bass-Invader

TRIBE Member
It is difficult to comment on stuff like this when the anger at some purported systemic failure is wholly predicated on unverifiable anecdotal evidence.
 

agentRC4

TRIBE Member
Either way, because disability benefit is by definition not temporary, there is also no motivation to learn coping mechanisms and maybe get to a point where you can compartmentalize the crazy and become a productive member of society. .
This is incorrect. ODSP disability files are reviewed for eligability and RTW readiness at certain points throughout the life of the claim. If their mental condition begins to improve then ODSP will start working with the individual to find suitable employment.
 

alison87

TRIBE Member
Reviewing a permanent benefit isn't the same thing as a making a benefit temporary to start with. In Australia they have sickness benefit and disability pension to differentiate. But point taken.
 

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
...where our tax dollars are being pissed away (e.g. hand-outs for agriculture, big business, families, home-owners).
Oh I'd love to see which home owner benefits you're talking about. The only benefits I have are the homeless people living in my house. No tax breaks for me unless I have a kid or marry a lady-boy.

-jM
A&D
 
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janiecakes

TRIBE Member
Reviewing a permanent benefit isn't the same thing as a making a benefit temporary to start with. In Australia they have sickness benefit and disability pension to differentiate. But point taken.
ODSP is not a permanent benefit - people become ineligible all the time, or go off of their own accord because they have found work that jives with their disability, and people getting benefits have to regularly prove financial and medical eligibility to keep getting them. If they can't work for medical reasons but their condition is not expected to prevent them from working for more than a year, they would go on OW. So here we differentiate too, we just call it something else.
 

Dave Boyd

New Member
I have been on ODSP since 2003 at the age of 18 due to a child psychiatrist's report on autism. My dad says I have the mild form of it. I have worked temp agencies in the past and enjoy contributing to society and making a difference. It helps going outside in the world instead of staying home all the time. Recently I applied to The Home Depot. My interview went well for an overnights stocking position. I was told I did not get the job in my inbox. How am I supposed to earn lots of money if employers don't want to hire me? I keep working temp and the odd job so I can fill in my résumé more to impress employers to put them on their payroll. I have always been on a temp agency's payroll.
 

wickedken

TRIBE Member
I have been on ODSP since 2003 at the age of 18 due to a child psychiatrist's report on autism. My dad says I have the mild form of it. I have worked temp agencies in the past and enjoy contributing to society and making a difference. It helps going outside in the world instead of staying home all the time. Recently I applied to The Home Depot. My interview went well for an overnights stocking position. I was told I did not get the job in my inbox. How am I supposed to earn lots of money if employers don't want to hire me? I keep working temp and the odd job so I can fill in my résumé more to impress employers to put them on their payroll. I have always been on a temp agency's payroll.
I think many people fit into this situation.
 
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kyfe

TRIBE Member
I have been on ODSP since 2003 at the age of 18 due to a child psychiatrist's report on autism. My dad says I have the mild form of it. I have worked temp agencies in the past and enjoy contributing to society and making a difference. It helps going outside in the world instead of staying home all the time. Recently I applied to The Home Depot. My interview went well for an overnights stocking position. I was told I did not get the job in my inbox. How am I supposed to earn lots of money if employers don't want to hire me? I keep working temp and the odd job so I can fill in my résumé more to impress employers to put them on their payroll. I have always been on a temp agency's payroll.

How about re-educating yourself in a field you want to work in, you could also volunteer as a way to get your foot in the door of that industry.
Ask for feedback from those you interview with and grow from their critiques. You gotta start somewhere and if you show initiative it may help you get a leg up on the competition. Having not worked steady for 15 years will be a red flag to any recruiter but what you did during that time could offset that concern

best of luck
 
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