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Meanwhile in Iraq... Islamic militants have seized half the country.

J

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
Puma said:
It would be interesting to bring back the original Iraq war Thread from back in the day and see some of the geniuses who are right now all like Obama is king and anti Iraq war but back then there was very few of us who said this whole thing is BS from the start. we were the minority every one was like rah rah lets go to war.
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I still recall sitting in a small hut in east Africa having lunch with Colin Powell on a small TV in the corner making the case for Iraq.

"How fuckin' stupid is this." I thought. "Well there goes the world."

AND YET AGAIN, I was right.

-jM
A&D
 
Bass-Invader

Bass-Invader

TRIBE Member
while the Americans caused Maliki's regime, it's a bit obtuse to deny that said regime's alienation of a large minority of the country is not a major causal factor in this outcome.
 
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praktik

praktik

TRIBE Member
Today's Iraq updates:

Behind the black flag: current, former ISIS fighters speak - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

Didn't somebody tell these Iraqis that their life is great cause Uncle Sam got rid of a dictator? Guess they didn't get the memo...

In Baghdad, residents despair of endless violence - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

And the other side of the coin:

ISIS seen as liberators by some Sunnis in Mosul - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

IS anyone else getting tired of hearing ISIS described as something noteworthy and new? "Al Qaeda on steroids" and the rest seem more likely to engender irrational reactions, and I'm not sure I buy that they are objectively worse than other actors in the same region, past and present.
 
wickedken

wickedken

TRIBE Member
Bass-Invader said:
while the Americans caused Maliki's regime, it's a bit obtuse to deny that said regime's alienation of a large minority of the country is not a major causal factor in this outcome.
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The things is that there was an apparent religious-based civil war prior to the departure of the Americans and prior to their "having finished the job". They essential nominated this guy, said resolve things, and left, acting like those middle management types that just expect things to be done regardless of the situation that exists. However, this guy *could* invite some fanatics to sit in their Parliament, I suppose.
 
wickedken

wickedken

TRIBE Member
Jeffsus said:
I still recall sitting in a small hut in east Africa having lunch with Colin Powell on a small TV in the corner making the case for Iraq.

"How fuckin' stupid is this." I thought. "Well there goes the world."

AND YET AGAIN, I was right.

-jM
A&D
Click to expand...

I think I remember at that point the world media was asking what was wrong with the American media.
 
Bass-Invader

Bass-Invader

TRIBE Member
wickedken said:
The things is that there was an apparent religious-based civil war prior to the departure of the Americans and prior to their "having finished the job". They essential nominated this guy, said resolve things, and left, acting like those middle management types that just expect things to be done regardless of the situation that exists. However, this guy *could* invite some fanatics to sit in their Parliament, I suppose.
Click to expand...

it's a difficult situation for anyone. if he had left in Saddam's technocrats in the government (because they are probably the only people with sufficient experience to do their jobs) then he would have been burned at the stake by the Shi'ite section of the country. If the Americans somehow decided to stay, Obama would be hung out to dry for breaking more promises and their country would be labelled as imperialist occupiers to an even higher degree than they already are. No matter what decision they would have made, it's all politically untenable. It's easy to look back in hindsight and say what was wrong, or to disregard political realities and say what should be done, but the world ain't so simple.
 
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alexd

alexd

Administrator
Staff member
These ISIS people seem rather well organized. Seizing key border posts, they have effectively consolidated control over most of the country and safeguarded their own supply lines.
 
alexd

alexd

Administrator
Staff member
Isis rebels declare 'caliphate' in Iraq and Syria

Islamist militant group Isis has said it is establishing a caliphate, or Islamic state, on the territories it controls in Iraq and Syria.

It also proclaimed the group's leader, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, as caliph and "leader for Muslims everywhere".

Setting up a caliphate ruled by the strict Islamic law has long been a goal of many jihadists.

Meanwhile, Iraq's army continued an offensive to retake the northern city of Tikrit from the Isis-led rebels.

The city was seized by the insurgents on 11 June as they swept across large parts of northern-western Iraq.

In a separate development, Israel called for the creation of an independent Kurdish state in response to the gain made by the Sunni rebels in Iraq.

Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, the group said, would become the leader of the state and would be known as "Caliph Ibrahim".

In the recording, the rebels also demanded that all Muslims "pledge allegiance" to the new ruler and "reject democracy and other garbage from the West".

Isis also said that from now on it would be known simply as "the Islamic State".

On Sunday, Iraqi government jets struck at rebel positions and clashes broke out in various parts of Tikrit, witnesses and officials said.

Troops had reportedly pulled back to the nearby town of Dijla as Saturday's initial offensive met stiff resistance.

The heavy fighting over the two days caused many casualties on both sides, eyewitnesses and journalists told the BBC.


The witnesses said the Iraqi forces had been hampered in their bid to retake Tikrit by the large number of improvised explosive devices laid on the approaches to the city.

Iraq said on Sunday it had received the first batch of military jets ordered from Russia in order to help fight the militants.

Meanwhile, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu called for the creation of an independent Kurdish state in response to gains made by Sunni insurgents in Iraq.

In a speech in Tel Aviv, he said the Kurds "are a nation of fighters and have proved political commitment and are worthy of independence."

Earlier this week, Iraqi Kurd leader Massoud Barzani told CNN that "the time is here for the Kurdistan people to determine their future".

Correspondents say the Kurds have long held aspirations for an independent state but they remain divided between Syria and Turkey, Iran and Iraq.

The international community, including neighbouring Turkey and the US, remain opposed to the breakup of Iraq.

from BBC
 
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P

Primavera

TRIBE Member
Imagine just HOW much better off the world would be without fundamentalist muslims?

The entire middle east would probably thrive economically.

The entire West and most of Europe could breathe a massive sigh of relief and save untold billions not having to fight wars against militants/fundamentalists blowing themselves and their neighbours up.
 
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I

Inv si le

TRIBE Promoter
I've been seeing a lot of headlines reading something like "ISIS threat to America greater than 9/11" or whatever and I can't help but wonder how that could be possible with the NSA in place.

Then I remember that the 2 individuals who were responsible for the Boston Bombing were on a watch-list and that Russia told the FBI specifically about their intentions (Russia warned U.S. about Boston Marathon bomb suspect Tsarnaev: report | Reuters). How they could slip through the cracks and actually cause harm to others boggled my mind.

Then I found this article: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/o...ped-along-by-the-fbi.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0 which goes ahead and states "Of the 22 most frightening plans for attacks since 9/11 on American soil, 14 were developed in sting operations." Or developed by the very people in place to protect us.

Now I hear about the "imminent" threat of an ISIS attack on American soil, and with so many bureaus and branches in place supposedly tracking "terrorists" I'm just not sure how concerned I should actually be. You would think that these kind of threats are the entire reason for having the NSA in place, so that they can prevent these kind of events. But when something as simple as direct intel from KSB to the FBI can't even stop the Boston Bombing from happening, you have to start wondering what's the point, no?

Top U.S. military brass warns ISIS has ‘apocalyptic, end-of-days’ plan that can’t be stopped without attacks in Syria Top U.S. military brass warns ISIS has ‘apocalyptic, end-of-days’ plan that can’t be stopped without attacks in Syria | National Post

So now, in order for us to be safe, we must "attack" Syria?

Also, I just feel it relative to mention the numerous times Hilary Clinton stated that America created Al-Qaeda, like WTF is going on?
 
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