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Latest revelations seal the deal for Bonds' legacy

TECHno addict

TRIBE Member
In the end, there is only one question that needs to be asked:

Do you believe Barry Bonds, or the book?

If you believe Bonds, then you believe the third-leading home run hitter in the history of Major League Baseball is the victim of an unrelenting federal and media conspiracy designed to frame him for the use of performance-enhancing drugs.

If you believe the excerpts of "Game of Shadows," then you believe that Bonds and his mind-boggling, bloated numbers of 1998-2004 (he missed most of last season with an injury) are a fraud.

I believe the book. I think Bonds is -- or was -- a human Walgreens, a grotesque and insulting example of better baseball through chemistry. And I think he should slither away, joining Mark McGwire, Sammy Sosa and Rafael Palmeiro in forced baseball exile.

Bonds is finished. He might play again, but there is only a chalk outline left around his integrity and home run totals. And the only way he gets into Cooperstown is if he spends the $14.50 for a Hall of Fame admission ticket.

Winstrol. Deca-Durabolin. Insulin. Testosterone decanoate. Human growth hormones. Norbolethone. Trenbolone. Clomid. These are the substances and steroids Bonds is alleged to have injected or ingested. They are the medicine cabinet of a cheater.

This sign was up in September of last season. Expect more of the same.
Clomid is prescribed to women for infertility. Trenbolone enhances the muscle tone of cattle. Deca-Durabolin is a medication used in the treatment of kidney failure-related amnesia. And yet, write "Game of Shadows" co-authors Mark Fainaru-Wada and Lance Williams, Bonds did so with regularity and without remorse.

Bonds always has been a drama king. He was insufferable in high school, insufferable at Arizona State, and insufferable now. But his statistics didn't come with a personality rating. Love him or loathe him, you simply couldn't argue with his talent. He arrived at the big leagues as a prodigy, a lithe, five-tool player. He will leave as a cautionary tale, an asterisk wearing a San Francisco Giants uniform.

How can you not read the work of the two San Francisco Chronicle writers and not at least wonder if Bonds knew about the working end of a syringe. Either you're naïve or a member of the Bonds family.

When asked Tuesday at the Giants' Scottsdale facility if he was aware of the contents of "Game of Shadows," Bonds told reporters, "Nope. I won't even look at it. For what? I won't even look at it. There's no need to."

Here's guessing the Feds will. So will the IRS. So will his ex-wife's divorce attorney. So will MLB commissioner Bud Selig, though he was conveniently in Milwaukee on Tuesday, despite Team USA making its World Baseball Classic debut here at Chase Field. An MLB spokesperson said Selig hadn't seen the book and had no comment regarding the book's allegations.

Then again, what can Selig do other than secretly root that Fainaru-Wada and Williams got it right? In so many ways MLB, the owners and the Players Association share part of the blame for creating this situation. For years they were helpless -- or clueless -- when it came to addressing the issue of performance-enhancing drugs.

Faced with a choice of remaining true to the game, or becoming what he once despised, Bonds allegedly chose home runs over ethics. But even as his numbers increased almost exponentially, as kayak-gridlock became commonplace at McCovey's Cove, as the countdown to baseball immortality became more pronounced, there was always an uneasiness about Bonds' accomplishments. They didn't seem, for the lack of a better word, natural.

Bonds has his defenders -- lot's of them, including Derrek Lee, the Chicago Cubs All-Star first baseman who is everything Bonds isn't: a player who handles himself with grace and dignity. Lee hadn't heard of the book excerpt until he was asked about it after Team USA's 2-0 victory against Mexico.

"What's the story?" he said. "I don't know the story."

It was explained: detailed allegations of performance-enhancing drug use by Bonds.

Lee dismissed the latest revelations. It wasn't a story, he said. Bonds has never been caught using steroids. Leave him alone.

"People have been alleging him forever," Lee said.

Lee believes Bonds. I don't, and never will. I don't believe in coincidences, or physical transformations so stark that you do a double-take. I don't believe the numbers of 2001.

The tragedy of it all is that Bonds didn't need the alleged chemical boost. His legacy was secure. His Hall of Fame plaque was a done deal. It didn't matter if we thought he was a jerk because his statistics were so overpowering. No longer.

In recent years, perception was reality when it came to Bonds and the subject of steroid use. But this latest excerpt, complete with his smarmy grand jury testimony, convinces me reality is reality when applied to Bonds.

Earlier Tuesday afternoon, about an hour or so before Team USA's game, Alex Rodriguez was asked about the death of Hall of Famer Kirby Puckett, who died a day earlier from complications stemming from a major stroke.

"One of the saddest days in baseball for me," said A-Rod.

I felt the same way Tuesday. This time it was the death of a reputation.

Barry Bonds, rest in peace.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/colu...&id=2358771&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines
 
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fewl

TRIBE Member
It was a travesty when those 3 cheats Mcgwire, Sosa and Bonds went on to surpass Maris' record. I hope Bonds has the class to walk away before he disgraces Aaron's record.
 

D1Willow

TRIBE Member
20 years in the majors and Bonds has never shown any class. He has always got away with cheating, and when confronted with the facts, balls on about a conspiracy again him when in fact he is commiting a conspiracy against baseball. He thinks he should be given a hero's welcome when he comes back.
What makes anyone think he'll have any class now?'
 

agentRC4

TRIBE Member
I really wanted to stay out of this thread but I can't. Bonds IMO is top 3 EVER, (thats right I said it). I really don't care about his personality. The press never gave him a fair shot. His pre 1998 numbers were sick - still warranted top 5. How many MVP's before 1998 - 3!

If Bonds is guilty then so are McGwire and Sosa. How these two go unpunished if Bonds does is beyond me. Oh wait, Bonds has a bad personality and everyone likes the Roid Freak, Bat Corking SOSA??? Palmero fucking LIED to the American people on TV in the Senate, yet its all forgiven?

PLEASE this is so hypocritical of everyone. If McGwire or Sosa were challenging Hammering Hanks record do you think the press would be looking at every pee bottle, paper trail and going through garbabe on the street?

Bonds does a ton of Charity work, sure hes a bit surley towards the press and thinks hes Jeasus, but you can't deny his ability, hand speed ect..... most of which roids does not help.

Thanks,

Management.


p.s MLB didn't care about drugs in the late 90's because their product sucked. Now that its back, they want to persecute one of the main reasons MLB is back??
 
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crazedcanuck

TRIBE Member
agentRC4 said:
I really wanted to stay out of this thread but I can't. Bonds IMO is top 3 EVER, (thats right I said it). I really don't care about his personality. The press never gave him a fair shot. His pre 1998 numbers were sick - still warranted top 5. How many MVP's before 1998 - 3!

If Bonds is guilty then so are McGwire and Sosa. How these two go unpunished if Bonds does is beyond me. Oh wait, Bonds has a bad personality and everyone likes the Roid Freak, Bat Corking SOSA??? Palmero fucking LIED to the American people on TV in the Senate, yet its all forgiven?


Like the article, and Dan Wetzel's states, MLB, the Giants, The Cards... they are all to blame in the court of public outrage.

However If you want to disect the other's from the steroid era, you have to rate the uproar to not only timing of when it was in the media, and the stage of their playing career, and the level of their star.

Bond's catches the most flack because he is the biggest star of all of them. He beat the HR record, he's chasing the alltime..he's the one that's frankensteined his body to the degree that he can do what he's done the past 5yrs. Also, his arrogance not only in his behaviour in the media (post game diatribes anyone?) as well as his refusal to deal with the topic over the years is as much a reason as any. He's created the hostility himself for the most part, and he could have stopped it as well had he even attempted to deal with it in the slightest.

You are simply imagining a free pass for the others. McQuire ran away just before the storm, and has been trashed in recent years, achievements questioned, hall of fame status in serious jeopardy, grand jury testimony mocked and scrutinized. Giambi went through probably the closest to Bonds, an almost Bertuzzi-esque media circus where I dare say he was attacked more vicously, although for a shorter time, than Bonds was last year. Palmeiro is a laughing stock, and ended his career in such shame and riducule, he hardly got a free pass, on the field or the media.

This part of the article sums it up for me why Bond's career keeps him from "top 3 all time"
The tragedy of it all is that Bonds didn't need the alleged chemical boost. His legacy was secure. His Hall of Fame plaque was a done deal. It didn't matter if we thought he was a jerk because his statistics were so overpowering. No longer.
 

fewl

TRIBE Member
Nuff said. Amen. Thanks crazedcanuck for reciprocating it so eloquently what we all think.
 
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fleaflo

TRIBE Member
agentRC4 said:
PLEASE this is so hypocritical of everyone. If McGwire or Sosa were challenging Hammering Hanks record do you think the press would be looking at every pee bottle, paper trail and going through garbabe on the street?
Bonds is in the center of it all mostly because of his association with Balco. He was their poster-boy and as stated in the SI article, the Feds were gunning for Balco.

In the end, I'd love to hear about what worked the best for Bonds. Was it the Human Growth Hormone that did the best work? Is that what Lance Armstrong has been using all these years.

What a crazy cat and mouse game.
 

fewl

TRIBE Member
2canplay said:
People say the darndest things on the internets.
My appologies. Next time I will try to dumb down my responses to accomodate you. Maybe something like 'that goes ditto for me' or 'I second that.'

Cheers
 

SJN

TRIBE Member
fewl said:
My appologies. Next time I will try to dumb down my responses to accomodate you. Maybe something like 'that goes ditto for me' or 'I second that.'

Cheers

do you know what "reciprocating" means?
it's usually a good idea to understand words before you try to use them in a sentence
 

fewl

TRIBE Member
SJN said:
do you know what "reciprocating" means?
it's usually a good idea to understand words before you try to use them in a sentence
Yes I do sir and I will be sure to hand in my assignment tomorrow.
 
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dg0425

TRIBE Member
Juice or no juice I don't think you can take anything away from the guys that used it because it wasn't prohibited my MLB until 2003. I'm against steroid use but if your going to say the records shouldn't stand because these guys used drugs you could also say the equipment is different now, some of the rules have changed and the game is different. Just my thoughts.

I think its a shame that MLB was targetted meanwhile the governor of CA recently hosted the 2006 Arnold Classic and paraded around with obvious juicepigs.
 

fleaflo

TRIBE Member
dg0425 said:
Juice or no juice I don't think you can take anything away from the guys that used it because it wasn't prohibited my MLB until 2003.
Bonds won 3 MVP's before the juice. His stats may not count, but it's hard to believe they can keep him out based on just his early work.

I wonder if Ken Griffey Jr's problems with his tendons/hammy's had anything to do with useage? Brady Anderson averaged 15 hrs in the 4 years prior to 1996 when he suddenly popped over 50. He signs a big contract and in the 4 years following, he averages 18 hrs a season.

Looking thru the stats for the 90s, the sudden power surge just jumps out at you.
 

crazedcanuck

TRIBE Member
Griffey always had the skill and power. If he was juicing he'd of been much bigger, and not as injury prone.

He simply blew out his wheels, and never really fully recovered after that IMO.
 

Kinger

TRIBE Member
crazedcanuck said:
Griffey always had the skill and power. If he was juicing he'd of been much bigger, and not as injury prone.

He simply blew out his wheels, and never really fully recovered after that IMO.

Exactly. Juice keeps you from getting injured and even helps some nagging injuries recover. Hopefully Bonds doesn't play more than a few weeks this year before retiring. He's a loser.
 

fleaflo

TRIBE Member
crazedcanuck said:
Griffey always had the skill and power. If he was juicing he'd of been much bigger, and not as injury prone.
Sorry if I don't take your word for it. His best years came at a time when a lot of people were using so to not consider the fact that he may have been using is pure hipocracy.

Griffey's power came from his lower body so there was really no need for him to bulk up his upper body. When he started getting the nagging hammy/tendon injuries I could never understand why they couldn't get him sorted out.
 
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fleaflo

TRIBE Member
"I stand before my fellow Americans of all races and creeds. I promise to uphold the proud traditions of lying, cheating and stealing that our forefathers used to build this great nation. I promise to tell half-truths, white-lies and abuse the 5th amendment to further said falsehoods. I am proud to be an American and swear allegiance to this great country of mine"

steroids_h.jpg
 

Bernnie Federko

TRIBE Member
MLB to investigate Bonds

bondsjr_i.jpg


A baseball official told The Associated Press on Wednesday that final plans for the investigation were still pending, as was a definite answer from George Mitchell.

NEW YORK (AP) -- Major League Baseball will investigate past steroid use by Barry Bonds and other players and plans to hire former U.S. Senate majority leader George Mitchell to lead the effort, ESPN reported Wednesday.

A baseball official told The Associated Press on Wednesday that final plans for the investigation were still pending, as was a definite answer from Mitchell. An announcement was expected later this week.

The official spoke on condition of anonymity because commissioner Bud Selig has not yet made an announcement.

Selig has said for several weeks that he was evaluating how to proceed in the wake of "Game of Shadows," a book by two San Francisco Chronicle reporters detailing alleged extensive steroid use by Bonds and other baseball stars.
barry_bonds_2004-12-15.jpg

barry_bonds_2005-02-23.JPG
 
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