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Just read this on the CBC Web Site! WTF?

man_slut

TRIBE Member
THis sounds like something you would here from our US neighbours. Read for yourselves:

'Home-grown terrorists' living in Canada: CSIS
Last Updated Mon, 29 May 2006 20:15:19 EDT
CBC News
Canada's spy service is warning of an increasing threat from "home-grown terrorists" already living in communities across the country.

Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS) deputy director of operations Jack Hooper made the comments Monday before a Senate defence committee.

He says young Canadians from immigrant backgrounds are becoming radicalized through the internet and are looking for targets at home, not abroad.

"They are virtually indistinguishable from other youth. They blend in very well to our society, they speak our language and they appear to be — to all intents and purposes — well-assimilated," he said.

"[They] look to Canada to execute their targeting."

The men responsible for the 2005 transit bombings in London were from immigrant families, said Hooper.

"I can tell you that all of the circumstances that led to the London transit bombings, to take one example, are resident here now in Canada," he said.
(WTF??? This is very Orwellian)

Training camps in Afghanistan produce terrorists, said Hooper, including a Canadian resident who played a key role in an earlier attack.

"The individual who trained the bombers in the August 1998 attack on the U.S. Embassy in Nairobi was a former resident of Vancouver who fought in Afghanistan," he said.

That is a good reason for Canadian troops to remain in Afghanistan, he said.

(WTF???? He didn't just say this was a good reason for us to stay in Afghanistan???? rhetorical)
Hooper, who complained about cuts in funding, says it is difficult to properly screen immigrant applicants.

Of the roughly 20,000 from the Pakistani-Afghanistan region, Hooper said CSIS could only vet about "one-tenth." (Ahhhhhhhh!!!! It's all coming together now... Someone needs money!)

The Senate committee is looking into Canada's mission in Afghanistan, which has recently been extended two years until 2009. About 2,300 soldiers are currently deployed in the country.

LINK
 
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judge wopner

TRIBE Member
so are you proposing that there is no threat and no illicit activity going on in canada that supports global terrorism?

or are bombings and the like that happen in other countries not your concerns as long as they dont happen in canada why bother investigating possible links?

why do you paint a black and white picture where the suggestion of the existance of terrorist conspirators is orwellian and the product of rascism or paranoia?

cant there be a reasonable middle ground that says we are safe in canada over all but there exist elements of our society that may in varying degrees support or be complicit in terrorist activity abroad?

the air india bombing was planned and executed in canada, that was a significant terrorist event in my mind, would you have called the investigation of sikh extremists rascist and unfounded or do you consider it an "indian" problem that just happened to be on canadian soil? couldnt there be a way to investigate without being paranoid or be a fear mongerer?
 
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man_slut

TRIBE Member
judge wopner said:
why do you paint a black and white picture where the suggestion of the existance of terrorist conspirators is orwellian and the product of rascism or paranoia?

You can't tell me that Jack Hooper (Canada's Jack Bauer) wasn't sounding somewhat extreme in his description of possible terrorist threats?

cant there be a reasonable middle ground that says we are safe in canada over all but there exist elements of our society that may in varying degrees support or be complicit in terrorist activity abroad?

Yes but that's not how the CSIS is dealing with the issue. They are sounding very paranoid and... AMERICAN.:eek: I mean I was expecting Condi to be quoted as saying there could be a mushroom cloud in TORONTO!


couldnt there be a way to investigate without being paranoid or be a fear mongerer?
I don't think there can be a way to investigate "terrorism" without being somewhat intrusive and paranoid.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
man_slut said:
I don't think there can be a way to investigate "terrorism" without being somewhat intrusive and paranoid.
i thought eddie bauer was canada's jack bauer....
(rev's up Eddie Bauer Jeep Cherokee limited edition)

its that line between saying there are criminal elements in canada, some have ties to or are complicit in operations involving terrorism. it may be housing operatives, logistics, intel and the other behind the scenes stuff,
but i think its an equally knee jerk response to see it all as superfluous or rascist.

there has to be a defined space where CSIS and the RCMP are mandated to investigate and verify that threats may exist without conjouring up images of the SS?
 
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man_slut

TRIBE Member
judge wopner said:
its that line between saying there are criminal elements in canada, some have ties to or are complicit in operations involving terrorism. it may be housing operatives, logistics, intel and the other behind the scenes stuff,

there has to be a defined space where CSIS and the RCMP are mandated to investigate and verify that threats may exist without conjouring up images of the SS?
I agree... I just found Mr. Bauer's comments to be very sensationalist... he seems to want to strike some fear in us... which can lead to a more paranoid and racist view of "the enemy"...especially in Alberta.:D (I had to add that ... please don't read into it that much)
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
man_slut said:
I agree... I just found Mr. Bauer's comments to be very sensationalist... he seems to want to strike some fear in us... which can lead to a more paranoid and racist view of "the enemy"...especially in Alberta.:D (I had to add that ... please don't read into it that much)
ha!!

any time you alert people to a problem there is a chance it could be taken and twisted by the ignorant into rascist fodder.

when the police cheif says there are serious organized crime issues in toronto, does that mean increased chances of anti-italian, jamacian and russian sentiment by the public?

what about the tamil gang task force, does their existance provide fuel to the rasicsts who dont like brown people?

does teh threat of people taking things the wrong w2ay or misusing them to fuel their rascist agenda warrant not carrying out enforcement/investigative activity?

how stupid do you actualy think people are that think every brown person is a terrorist?
isnt that kind of sweeping generalization the same type of stupidity you are hoping wont happen when there is talk of terrorist issues in canada?
 

octo

TRIBE Member
i think the americans would love for Canadians to percieve a big terrorist threat to canada.

last week when there was some sort of gunfight in afghanistan the US called in an airstrike on a village. of course there was all sorts of carnage and claimed civilian deaths. my immediate thought was "what a bad pr move to raze an entire village" now i'm thining the US wants the afghanis to turn more violently agains the international forces there. even if it's the US causing civilian deaths, be it bombs or crashing their vehicles into traffic jams, the afghanis will start to associate all foreing troops and countries with evil occupiers.

what was the point of that press conference other than to stir up fear?
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
octo said:
the afghanis will start to associate all foreing troops and countries with evil occupiers.

They have thought of all foreign troupes as evil occupiers for the last 10 generations. That isn't going to go away ever! Not to support bombing civilians but its isn’t going to change a blessed thing. The only warlords who like us are the ones we’re paying. Those that aren’t being paid are trying to disrupt as much as possible to insure the stability of there opium operations.
 
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man_slut

TRIBE Member
judge wopner said:
ha!!

any time you alert people to a problem there is a chance it could be taken and twisted by the ignorant into rascist fodder.

Yeah but alerting people in a paranoid manner to a problem that has an existing racist stigma is not a good idea. Bauer's statements were meant to insight fear. It was meant to instill fear in our most ignorant and non-informed white populas and than whomever else may be as ignorant as most orientalist.

when the police cheif says there are serious organized crime issues in toronto, does that mean increased chances of anti-italian, jamacian and russian sentiment by the public?

NO! But rewind 40 years ago and yes this would have instigated some kind of racial animosity amongst our protistant opressors as it was a time of war and Italy was our enemy! As for Jamaicans... I would say that YES a police cheifs statements can raise the anti-Jamiacan sentiment or just anti-black sentiment as most whites and asians can't tell the differeance.

what about the tamil gang task force, does their existance provide fuel to the rasicsts who dont like brown people?

Probably...

does teh threat of people taking things the wrong w2ay or misusing them to fuel their rascist agenda warrant not carrying out enforcement/investigative activity?

But that's not the point. Mr.Bauer is insighting paranoia... racist paranoia!

how stupid do you actualy think people are that think every brown person is a terrorist?

Have you ever been to Milton? Or Alberta? Talk to the white folk there and than come back to me with that question.

isnt that kind of sweeping generalization the same type of stupidity you are hoping wont happen when there is talk of terrorist issues in canada?

I'm not following you here...
I'm just wanting our government, especially people like Bauer, to not use American/German style paranoia to keep us informed of possible terrorist threats.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
octo said:
so you're saying the afghanis make no distinction between american and canadian troops?

some do, some dont.

some are glad canada is there,
others arent.

of the ones that dont want us there, a small % are taking arms against troops.

but seems like there is a general feeling that we are a welcome addition to the forces there, but that small % can have a serious effect on the sentiment with the recent rash of deaths.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
man_slut said:
I'm just wanting our government, especially people like Bauer, to not use American/German style paranoia to keep us informed of possible terrorist threats.

dude,

rascism exists across the board.

yes some people are dumb and think all brown people are terrorists. lucky for us most people dont think this, thats why we manage to function as a society.

just becasue every guy at the bar would love to nail the pretty blonde in teh corner, doesnt mean its gonna turn into a gang bang.

its like the argument that condoms in school bathrooms will encourage kids to have sex. its appealing to he lowest common denominator.

the only german style propaganda that would be happening is your insistance that mention of threats amounts to rascist fear mongering, implying the populace is too stupid to handle what a CSIS director says.

we are now about 24 hours since this appeared in the CBC, are brown people being attacked with greater frequency? rounded up? are people visibly paniked or suspicious? has the government issues any wide ranging public statments to quell our fears that the CSCS jack bauer stired?
 

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
octo said:
so you're saying the afghanis make no distinction between american and canadian troops?

I'm saying to a warlord in control of a parcel of land the Americans paid far more money to buy my alliance. Once when they are gone and the Canadians offer peanuts compared to what the opium is worth the Canadians simply become another target.

When the americans landed they gave out hard currency to buy allainces they felt the needed. They paid millions out in a period of 6 months. Canada didn't fully inherit this deal and on top of that we have a policy against bribing warlords with hard cash, its not in the budget.

Thus over time there is nothing for us to become other than the targets of well funded opium cartels that will loose billions if afghanistan become stable with a functional government. Even the taliban was to much for most of these guys, to them any central authority is a new authority over them and something to be fought against.

So I think that the average person in the major cities views us positively and wants us there, but few of them hold power. The people who live under the thumbs of warlords probably don't mind us being there but fear that anything against there local dictator will fuck them in the end. And the only people with power the warlords would rather the Americans and the American money they pay for peace but will resort to opium and fighting if not given the choice. To them we are the broke ass pain in the butt that will likely break easily.
 
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man_slut

TRIBE Member
judge wopner said:
just becasue every guy at the bar would love to nail the pretty blonde in teh corner, doesnt mean its gonna turn into a gang bang.

:confused:

its like the argument that condoms in school bathrooms will encourage kids to have sex. its appealing to he lowest common denominator.

How and what are you defining as the lowest denominator?

the only german style propaganda that would be happening is your insistance that mention of threats amounts to rascist fear mongering, implying the populace is too stupid to handle what a CSIS director says.

Huh! Me mentioning the CSIS' horrible attempt at fear propoganda is nothing like German style propoganda! You can't even compare the two. What is wrong with pointing out a bunch of quotes by a government official whose use of the English language appears to be in line with propagating fear so his agency can get more funding?

we are now about 24 hours since this appeared in the CBC, are brown people being attacked with greater frequency? rounded up? are people visibly paniked or suspicious? has the government issues any wide ranging public statments to quell our fears that the CSCS jack bauer stired?

LOL! I never said this is happening or implied that this news release would do such a thing at this very moment. What I'm trying to say is that this type of communication could and will have a paranoid affect on our general populas. Remember people aren't as well read up as you are.
You have very valid points and I do think Canadians will have a somewhat balanced approach to this matter. But at the same time it doesn't take much to create a paranoid ferver about Arabs at this time in our current historical paradigm.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
man_slut said:
it doesn't take much to create a paranoid ferver about Arabs at this time in our current historical paradigm.
youre telling me.

this persian dude almost knocked my teeth out in soccer,
i went to head the ball, he went to kick it and bang!!! ouch!!

he didnt even apologize so i let him know i was gonna call immigration on his illegal ass..

he wasnt too happy about it, so i told him to go back to tajikstan or whatever the fuck two donkey town he came from and dig into a nice bowl of "shut the fuck up" stew,

but he didnt hear me, i guess my durka isnt as good as i thought because he turned red in the face (odd for a brown guy i know) and lunged at me for real, too bad for him my ninja buddies were like right there but he couldnt see them because they are that good at being ninjas. they fucked him up proper. then we all went for a beer afterwards and it was all forgotten.

the lesson:

soccer is the UN of sports. :D
 

Colm

TRIBE Member
man_slut said:
You have very valid points and I do think Canadians will have a somewhat balanced approach to this matter. But at the same time it doesn't take much to create a paranoid ferver about Arabs at this time in our current historical paradigm.
I know what you mean, but national security isn't something you want your government to pussyfoot around, right?
 
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