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Islam: a religion of violence?

Rocky

TRIBE Member
I agree.

The bible is also full of violence and death. The god of the bible is a tyrant, and a bit of a dick. It even says kill the gays.
 
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kriztian

TRIBE Member
I remember hearing this once and I think it holds true.

Islamic fundamentalists are the Christian equivalent to the Klu Klux Klan.
 

Rocky

TRIBE Member
Sam Harris' argument relies heavily on the fact that you can draw a direct line between the Islamic doctrine, which clearly states that all infidels should be killed, to the rise of Islamic extremism. Because many Jihadists are sometimes well-educated and come from relatively peaceful countries, he places less weight on lack of education and the existence of adverse political environments on the emergence of Islamic fundamentalism.

Acts of terrorism are a responses to injustices, either real or perceived. This only really applies to non-state actors. Terrorism by the state isn't called terrorism. Nevertheless, Catholics, Christians, Buddhists, as well as Muslims have engaged in terrorism. But, because a direct line can be drawn from the doctrine of Islam to acts of Jihad, acts of Muslim terrorism are the only acts that, according to Sam Harris, can be attributed mostly to religious doctrine. Also, since some Jihadists are well-educated and come form western nations, to Sam Harris, this points even more to the idea that religious doctrine plays the central role in the existence of Muslim extremism.

I think his argument is flawed.

If you remove the oppression of people in Muslim countries from the equation, it is far less likely that extremism will emerge and terrorism will occur. Poverty, lack of education, and political situation play a much larger role than Sam Harris believes in the emergence of extremism. His argument that, because Jihadists sometimes come from western nations and are well-educated, completely ignores the role of empathy. With empathy, the well-educated, western Jihadist can be affected by adverse political environments of his fellow Muslims. That many Johadists say they are doing god's work is the means of justification for their extremism. Sam Harris conflates both the trigger and the justification. The trigger for Jihadism, as it has been seen with terrorism perpetrated by people of other religions (or no religion), is the existence of real or perceived injustices. There are many forms of justification. The Muslim response is due to the existence of injustices perpetrated against the people of Islam, and the justification to their response is the Koran.

Focusing on Islam in order to put an end to terrorism is a distraction from a much greater factor that determines the emergence of extremism. The irrational beliefs of Muslims is certainly a factor, but a much smaller factor than Sam Harris believes.

"Everybody's worried about stopping terrorism. Well, there's a really easy way: stop participating in it." -- Noam Chomsky

How much anger has there (rightfully) been in response to last week's murder of one soldier? Now, consider what our response might be to something like this: U.S. jury convicts ex-Blackwater guards in 2007 Baghdad killings | Reuters

How many acts of terror are we, in the west, responsible for? How many of these acts go unreported and unpunished? Hundreds, probably thousands? Now, consider what our response might be if we if this happened to us. How would we justify our response? This in no way condones terrorism, it simply recognizes the laws of cause and effect and our own role in the state of the world today. But, it's much easier to ignore our own role and put a much greater weight on one, of many, retarded religions. Our religion is nationalism, and it blinds us from seeing the whole picture.
 

DJ Vuvu Zela

TRIBE Member
Being white is a race of a violence, evidence:

http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/publications/terror-from-the-right

Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

When will white people be reformed? Where are the voices of moderate whiteness?
Islam is a sacred set of doctrines. You're comparing it to race. (not to mention you're conflating "right-wing" with white - which is pretty silly).

I remember hearing this once and I think it holds true.

Islamic fundamentalists are the Christian equivalent to the Klu Klux Klan.
in terms of dangerous ideology, perhaps you can make the comparison, but you certainly can't in the amount of people who subscribe to that ideology.
 
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praktik

TRIBE Member
"Islam is a religion of violence"

Sweeping generalization - which is why I offered a Sweeping generalization in retort


And even if the violence by whites I linked to was not always religious (though often it was if you read the links) the common thread between genocide of the aboriginals, right wing terror since 1995 and Muslim extremist is an underlying root of tribalism and attacks against an "other"
 
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Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
Religion is a waste of fucking time and for people afraid of death...
This is the most intelligent thing said so far in this thread.

JEMZ:
I have read the Koran and you're correct, every version of it (that I've seen) has the vernacular also written in Arabic. I don't speak, read, or write Arabic. So, I have to read it in English. I assume that the translation of the Koran is accurate, given the fervor of the people who encourage the spreading of its word.

ROCKY:
I enjoyed your post.

EVERYONE ELSE:
since 01:24 absolutely 0% of anyone has offered to send me a Koran. Since that time (now 20:45 EDT) I have sent 6 books to takers, "The End of Faith" by Sam Harris.

Absolutely 0. Thanks for coming out, muslims.

-jM
A&D
 

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
I'm at 8 books now so, they cost me about $21 a piece, so I am going to end this free offer.

It seems like most people are interested in Sam Harris' idea of "The End of Faith", and nobody is interested in sending my a version of the Koran, or any of the Hadiths.

Well, to be sure, let's extend the situation. Would you like a free Bible? I will send you a Bible if you PM me. Free.

-jM
A&D
 

Jeffsus

TRIBE Member
Hey, you, reading this? You are a Muslim.

Allah requires you to accept my invitation to send a Koran to every infidel.

Allah DEMANDS you to do it, if you are muslim. Send your name! Are you a Muslim?

-jM
A&D
 
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Yorkz

TRIBE Member
Rocky, thanks for the thoughtful viewpoint. I'm not a practicing Muslim but it's still depressing to see the average level of discourse out there.
 
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