1. Hi Guest: Welcome to TRIBE, Toronto's largest and longest running online community. If you'd like to post here, or reply to existing posts on TRIBE, you first have to register on the forum. You can register with your facebook ID or with an email address. Join us!


Discussion in 'Jungle Room' started by Kinetic, Feb 13, 2002.

  1. Kinetic

    Kinetic TRIBE Member

    Hip-Step is Hip Hop/Funk/Female Vocals/ a lickle Ragga influenced Drum'n Bass.

    There is a huge Hip-Step scene in NYC and I think with the T-dot having one of the best Hip Hop scenes and the second (maybe third) best D&B scenes in the world it's just logical that we should have a HS scene of our own.....

    We gave the world names such as Freaky Flow and Capital J......

    Alot of D&B heads are (or used to be) Hip Hop heads........

    Lemme know your thoughts, they will be appreciated

    One Love.

  2. AVE

    AVE TRIBE Member

    meh, not really interested

    while i used to be into hip hop quite a bit a few years back, i'm definitely not a fan of 'hip hop influenced drum & bass', or ragga for that matter

    and i really dislike both Freaky Flow and Cap J, so that's not a selling point for me at all.........but what do i know?

    I'm sure there's alot of peeps who would be down for this, I'm jsut not one of them:)
  3. sauce

    sauce TRIBE Member

    If this is all we have given the world then i don't want to be from toronto.
  4. T

    T TRIBE Member


    I dont mind some funk or vocals in my DnB, but I think using another label, especially "Hip-Step" is shite.:D
  5. smile

    smile TRIBE Member

    LOL sauce!

    i concur.

    i'm not really down with the hip-step bizniss.

    and don't get me wrong, i LOVE hip hop (even a lot of the new stuff).

    i just can't STAND scratching over d&b. it RUINS it.

    all i can think when i hear scratching over d&b is "i just want to hear the TUNE".
  6. Nebu kad

    Nebu kad TRIBE Member

    i think eventually there may be a proper hybrid between the two styles but if you are talking about cap j styles then i'm not a fan of it.
  7. Kinetic

    Kinetic TRIBE Member


    Thanks for all the positive feedback.:rolleyes:

    First of all, Toronto has alot more than FF and J to offer, obviuosly. It was just an aside. (other notable contributions VS, Visionary, Stranjah, Catchin Wreck, Hustlin Beats)

    To me, mixing full-cycle tunes into one and other over and over RUINS JUNGLE. And really (this point has been debated) how many emcees just regurgitate the same 7 verses evertime they are on the mic? OR how many times have you seen a DJ mix one record into another and looked like they could have cared less and just wanted to look cool? I want to hear CREATIVITY. I want to see a show. I want to see a Disc Jockey (with skills). I want to hear and emcee with more that 7 memorized verses, some FREESTYLE maybe? Maybe I'm not such a Drum'n Bass purist, but some of the old ways are stale and redundant. I respect tradition, but admire progression.

    BTW shite or not the title HIP-STEP has been established by name such as Ming & FS, J-Smooth, Odi, Pish-Posh and other established names.

    Don't get me wrong I LOVE D&B and Jungle.
    But how many times do we all have to sing along to
    "Boom-shack-boom me kna selecta, this one goes out to each and every rava" ?????

    One Love.

  8. T

    T TRIBE Member

    Dude, I couldnt care less who's spitting what name. HIP STEP sounds like a dirty south barn dance IMO. At the end of the day, its all fuckin jungle to me.

    I was a hip hop head before I was into jungle, and I love when the two are blended proper. Its been done for a long time. :)
  9. AVE

    AVE TRIBE Member

    and who does that?? There is alot more to DnB than 'Full Cycle'. If you don't think that jungle can survive on its own (without the blend of hip hop or reggae) than maybe you don't really like it very much.....why should drum & bass compromise itself, it can easily do well on its own, and has done for the last ten years, getting better and better, with top production(better than any other genre IMO)

    Also not a selling point with names like that, Pish-Posh hurts:D

    its all good:)
  10. Kinetic

    Kinetic TRIBE Member

    You're right AVE, maybe I don't like it very much:confused: . I LOVE IT.
    Full Cycle.....that was a pointed remark.
    It dosn't have to comprimise itself, anymore than it has already. D&B has assimilated EVERY form of music and made it it's own. Reggae, Hip Hop, House, Punk, Ska, Classical, Pop, R&B, Metal, Indusrial..... and some of these tunes have went on to be D&B classics. I don't think it is comprimising itself at all. If we had a city full of clone D&B DJ's that all played the same shit, it would be BORING.

    T: It's good to hear it's all fuckin JUNGLE. We honestly need more of that opinion in Toronto. There isn't the amount of PARTY that there used to be at Jungle parties. Too many people standing around analizing tunes and mixes, instead of partying. Seen?

    One Love.

  11. AVE

    AVE TRIBE Member

    true man, all I'm saying is that there is TONS of different styles of drum & bass out there, and I don't feel there's a need to rely on Hip Hop to make it interesting
  12. T

    T TRIBE Member

    Thats cuz half the crowd now are either bedroom dj's and/or upcomming producers and/or upcommin MC's.

    Peace :D
  13. Kinetic

    Kinetic TRIBE Member

    BIG UPS to AVE and T for some ill debates.......
    (here comes the shameless plug)
    For some HIP-STEP biznezz check out
    DJING FOR DUMMIES Feb 23 @ Runyx 108 Dundas or
    check the thread (i hope this works)


    One Love.


    PS: ODI THA RULER..........
  14. smile

    smile TRIBE Member

    NEWSFLASH: we DO. the vast majority of D&B dj's in toronto all play the same 10 tunes that mystical was caning three weeks ago.

    all except mystical's ass-lickers, who play the same tunes he was caning TWO weeks ago instead of three. (sucking dick for promo's? what?)


    the people playing different stuff (intimate, gamma ray, etc...) should never expect to play out on a BIG saturday night party (unless it's their own party), because the crowd doesn't care about the music anymore, all they want to hear is the same 10 tunes. if something even the SLIGHTEST BIT challenging to their little minds gets played, they stop dancing. it's true, i've seen it.

    bottom line? the only people who give a shit about jungle MUSIC anymore are the bedroom DJs and producers. the rest of the crowd only cares about the jungle SCENE (thuggin, jib, etc...)

    pretty bleak, huh?
  15. doughboy

    doughboy TRIBE Member

    Once again, and as always, props go out to my man Kinetic.

    Even if you don't persoanlly like his style, you have to admit that he is doing something new, fresh, and progressive. Those of you who want to debate shouldn't do so until you've heard him. Those of you who've heard him, go see him again, cause it won't be the same as last time.

    He started off with hip-hop lyrics over drum n' bass beats, added a little scratching here and there for flavour, and now the aresnal includes a whole bag o' funk, female vocals, and reggae added to the mix. How can anyone say that's not progressive?

    AVE: You said that there's tons of D&B out there, so then why can't adding hip-hop to it be another flavour to savour. Regardless, Kinetic adds more than just hip-hop and scratching to the mix. In fact, the last time I saw him, I was surprised at how different HIS sound has become.

    SMILE: You're right, this city is full of carbon copy DJ's. That's why when someone like Kinetic, and the rest of the Intimate crew (RESPECT), come along they breath new life into the scene.

    Drum and Bass does not have to concern itself with whether or not it is being compromised by augmenting itself with other genres of music, such as reggae, SKA, hip-hop, etc. Without this type of progression, we'd all be stuck with the same tunes. Without reggae we wouldn't have DJ SS, without ambient we wouldn't have LTJ Bukem, and without hip-hop we wouldn't have DJ Hype. Variety is the spice of life and the same goes with D&B.

  16. SE7EN

    SE7EN TRIBE Member


    I agree with a lot of your comments, but I have some points to make.

    way back when, people used to mix all kinds of jungle music together. ragga, atmospheric, dark, smooth, vocal, hardcore, and all kinds of jungle would assault the dancefloor across the span of a night. it didn't all sound the same, but people made it all work together, and the crowd felt it all. that was the most beautiful and productive time for both the culture/scene and the music.

    I feel part of what's wrong now is that people care too much about the music. who made what track, when it's coming/came out, who is playing it on dub, who's saying what about it on message boards, how it was made, what label it's on, who owns the label, why that label signed that artist, how a track uses the same sample as some other guy's shit, yadda yadda yadda was not even something people in the crowd thought about in, say, 1994. you just showed up and danced like a maniac until you fell down with crippling cramps in your quads, lungs burning, voicebox destroyed. the fact you knew nothing about the whole process of how this music was made and who was behind it that much more "hype." it was mysterious, challenging, and confounding shit that totally set it apart from the simplicity and "obviousness" of (ware)house, trance, and techno music that most everyone else was into.

    intimate djs+big parties: don't mix. I agree 100% (aside from terra and jim who are either/or). we know who we play for, where/when our music is appropriate. better yet, we know who we DON'T play for and where our music is NOT appropriate :) big parties, big venues, big prices, big names, all ages events, and that whole brand of stuff can be handled by those who are good at that. nothing to do with us. we just do what we know we do best, because that's the best way to do things.

    bedroom djs: I don't agree that the only people who care about the music are the bedroom djs, but I do agree that genuine progression truly tends to come from that certain percentage of bedroom djs who plays purely for themselves, thereby buying and playing music that represents them as an individually seeking an outlet for creative/personal/emotional expression. this makes them unique compared to people (known and unknown) who buy music to play for other people (ie crowds, ie promoters, ie friends) because that's the djs "job."

    cohesion: to bring it back around to this whole hip-step thing. since everyone right now is either on the whole "mature+soulful" bandwagon or the big name big concert thing now, it would be nice to just break off for a second for a reality check. things will work best if people in Toronto would just stop copying each other and do their own thing. if someone else is already doing something, sit down and put some creativity and individuality into your event so that you can create some variation in the system. there's no reason that because a couple companies are succeeding at oldschool events that everyone should do oldschool events. same with mature+soulful events or big events or ragga events or hardcore thrash jungle events or turntablism events. the more people doing more of the same shit the more boring and flat and bland everything is, no matter how fresh it seemed to be when the first few people led the way.

    yes they have happened before, but right now there aren't a lot of turntablism and hip-hop influenced jungle events going on. right now. that's key. there aren't a lot of ragga events going on right now. there aren't a lot of oldschool events going on right now. why is that exactly? because from the promoters to the producers to the djs to the punters paying at the door, we're all a bunch of monkeys and sheep? I feel that instead of exclusively homogenous bullshit we need ALL of these kinds of events to be offered in conjunction with what we already have going on. the more people who take risks and go against the current direction of (main)stream events (ie events that focus on the common bond that defines what mainstream is at any given point in time) while everyone else is occupied copying other people, the more variation we'll have, and the faster we'll go from bleak to bright.

    much respect to jim for giving us variaton and choice.


    ps speaking of variation. this syrous party tonight. what the hell? that's fucking variation kids. it has been done. but how long has it been since you were at a huge bash where all the musical genres were integrated. that's the key right there. I can't wait......
  17. feisty boy

    feisty boy TRIBE Member

    that applies to the dj's too, not just the promoters.

    aren't dj's supposed to be ARTISTS??
    and as such, shouldn't they be putting creativity and originality into their sets??
    shouldn't they be striving to do something a little different, something to set them apart from the crowd, something to give their sound an edge that people haven't heard before?

    instead, we have everyone caning the same tunes, because they know the kids will throw their hands up in the air and they'll get yet another rewind and they'll get asked back for another gig.

    promoters were pushing new sounds for a while over the last year or two, but it seems those nights have faded away.

    personally, i go out to hear songs i have NOT heard before, to be reminded of why i got into this scene in the first place - because it was the only music i had ever experienced that made me say "what the fuck IS that sound?"
    i don't go out to hear my favourite mixtape played in a different order, with another overpriced goon from the UK barking the same 5 phrases over top:
    yes, i'm having a good time inside the place
    no, i don't want a rewind
    no, you can't see some lightas
    i don't know where your big dogs are at
    who knows this one? we all do, dumbass
    just shut up and let me hear the tunes

    it's all about progression

Share This Page