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Corporate Sponsorship

Discussion in 'TRIBE Main Forum' started by starr, Mar 25, 2002.

  1. starr

    starr TRIBE Member

    As I read all the posts in the Wintergalactic Thread, all I can think is "where's the love"?
    I suppose I really don't need to ask that, as it's long gone.

    It seems the scene has finally shifted, right before our eyes.
    We've split into two groups, without even realizing it I suppose.

    Group #1:
    The Corporate Sponsor kids.
    We've all grown up, and it seems we've all become label whores...or dj whores. We just want the big names, and we really don't care who brings them in, or if we have to look at ads all night. Without Smirnoff and Benson & Hedges the Toronto scene would apparantly be unable to pull in big name dj's.

    I guess I don't mind it, it seems the next step, but it does make me sad. At the end of the day, promoters are sick and tired of whiny, bitchy, partiers that demand everything from them - and in the end they get no credit for "good times" and end up bankrupt. The days of the independent promoter bringing in big names are long over, which is fine I suppose, but it just feels a bit empty at parties sometimes, especially when I look up at see the Benson & Hedges logo hanging from the ceiling, instead of snowflakes (ala Wintergalactic 2001). So instead of risking their own money, they still throw parties but less risky ones.

    Toronto partiers seem to have a short memory span, and seem to be rather fickle with their loyalty - so why should promoters give a fuck about them anymore. You want decorations, then you better like that B&H logo, because you're going to be seeing it everywhere. And Toronto partiers have asked to be treated like they are the "consumer", so now they are...just remember this moment as a turning point that's all.

    Group #2:
    These kids are the die-hards. They are the life of the local scene and still throw parties that amaze me. Always innovative, and always high quality. Jin and the Wabi crew, David and Irving from Promise, I'd print other names but I don't want them to get too popular because then they'll end up extinct too.

    See that's what happens. Small companies throw great parties, and word gets around and then everyone wants to go. So they try and accomodate a large crowd, but these new patrons want to be treated like "customers".

    If you want to be a customer please go to B&H parties, and leave the local companies to the rest of us.
    We are now existing as mainstream and underground simultaneously. Corporate sponsorship is here to stay, but I doubt the underground will ever die. It's just that sometimes I feel like a hippie that just went out and bought the NEW beetle...know what I mean?
    My two cents.
  2. [- FuNKtiOn -]

    [- FuNKtiOn -] TRIBE Member

    when it comes to parties and events, I don't care who's throwing it, as long as good tunes are there.

    but with Benson & Hedges or Nokia or some other huge corporate name, I know that there will be a lot more money put into the production of an event.
    I know there will be better sound, better lighting, and bigger names.

    you could hang a giant cigarette with a DuMaurier logo in front of the turntables, and I wouldnt give a care as long as there is an effort outside of the marketing scheme to throw a good event.
    if it wasnt for the corporate whore's, a lot of dj's couldnt be afforded to be brought in.

    so it's a catch 22 really.
    love it or hate it, it's here to stay.
  3. kennyboy

    kennyboy TRIBE Member

    Like it or not, the cost to put on a big event with 1, or several big name dj's is very, very expensive.

    Unfortunately, only those with deep pockets can afford to put these sort of events on anymore. Blame the dj's, clubs, partiers or whoever you like. Times are changing.

    I think it's still possible to put on a great event, but on a much smaller scale.

    Just my 2 cents.
  4. kyfe

    kyfe TRIBE Member

    I hear you and well put... We have been sucessful the last 2 years throwing smaller parties and lately (mainly the 2 this month), our parties are warranting us finding a larger space, I always want our parties to have a small feel. Personal parties are the memorable ones. The big dj is for the people that know nothing or jump into it or for the critics, I myself am a bit of a critic and have seen almost everyone I want, but when i go to a big party it doesn't feel right or I end up standing/dancing around 20 of my friends that i see every week.....

    Funny though, but I think small parties are the future....once people realize the talent in toronto....they might realize who they should support.....

  5. Stormshadow

    Stormshadow TRIBE Member

    The sponsored parties make me feel cheap, like I've been whored-out.
    Personally, I don't think you need tonnes of "big" DJs and elaborate decorations to make a good party.
  6. Juan Love

    Juan Love TRIBE Member

    Promoters take note:
    There's only one thing that's needed to make any party a great party and it's not DJ talent...two words folks:


    Yeah yeah...I'm down...let's keep it underground and all but think, if Pepsi or BnH was sponsoring bashes would the heat that came down on the T.O scene a few years ago have gone down in the same manner? I doubt it.

    Seriously though:

    Having the backing of some major corporate weight isn't all bad in this light and then add to that the fact that the sponsored parties attract more and more people to the scene. This provides local talent with a vehicle of exposure which allows them to win over new audiences, which in turn stimulates the turnout and support of the local/indy scene.

    Doesn't everyone win?
  7. bucky

    bucky TRIBE Member

    Seems as though the only thing that is different is the personal touch, meaning before people knew the person or persons behind production companies... people know the "Dose" or "Destiny" etc... but when ya say "Nokia" or "Smirnoff" you're not really sure who's behind it and just think its a big corporate giant, when in reality it seems like these events are still handled by the people responsible for many big parties in the past in Toronto..... maybe i'm mistaken, but thats what it seems like... *shrug
  8. Fir3start3r

    Fir3start3r TRIBE Member

    Hear ya there Kyfe. :)
    We too understand that small events can afford to be a little different and cater to a more ecletic crowd.
    That is why we hold different styles of parties.
    We showcase live local talent that (while they have their own style) fuse with the current event prefectly.
    I don't think we'll ever do a 'large' corporately sponsered event mainly because of the headaches involved and sheer number of incidents that can rapidly put your event into a tailspin if not thought out well.
    Maybe it's me, but I find the larger the event, the harder it is to keep 'the vision' of the party you're trying to hold; although I thought SS and their State01 party back in Nov did an awesome job of decorating and getting their 'vision' across to me, the party goer. :)

    All in all, a person going to any event, large or small, will make up their own mind as to whether the promoter pulled it off or not in creating a memorable night for them. THAT to me is as important as who I'm going to see at the event (which is probably why I don't care for the sweaty Saturdays at the Guv when they bring a high profile DJ in).

  9. bitchass

    bitchass TRIBE Member

    I know in Calgary all the Benson and Hedges events are still done by Calgary promoters - Fehrenheit, Union and others. You see both names on the flyers and staff from both companies at the parties! I guess it allows the everyone to use their contacts in Calgary and the 'big city' money :)
  10. Uncle Bobby

    Uncle Bobby TRIBE Promoter

    Everybody knows somebody, ask around. I find you know someone giving some kind of input to a corperatly sponsered event that is or has been involved in another well known company. Does it really matter if B&H (or anyone else) is shelling out money to bring in a DJ that I want to here? I don't smoke, they aren't going to make me, but I sure like the parties.

  11. HappyJR

    HappyJR TRIBE Member

    Holy shit,

    I'm away from tribe for a week and a post like this happens!

    You tell em! :p

    (and no, I'm not being sarcastic)

    I personally have nothing against big parties that are corporate sponsored... People enjoy them, and they aren't hurting anyone, well... not really... I mean... I really doubt that their advertising is going to have much direct success. And they do bring in genuine talent, at accessible prices, so, why not.

    At the same time, I still have no interest in going.

    Parties like that do treat partiers like consumers, and basically, if you go, you are purchasing entertainment... And I'm not into being entertained. That's why I don't pay for movies either, and I wish I could say I don't play computer games... but... goddammit... I keep getting hooked every once in a while...

    But yeah, then you have the underground, wich (I think) is using the media that is available (wich is also used for entertainment) to send a message. Or at least, treating the media as an art form instead of as a consumer good. And that's just more up my alley.
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2002
  12. MalGlo

    MalGlo TRIBE Member

    I am all for corporate sponsors.

    It seems that in this day and age only the corporate big-guns can really afford to throw that completely crazy party with all the hugest dj's and proper decorations...etc.. and thats cool...

    Its all about a good time isn't it? and theres just now more variety in how to get it.. or would you like to stick with the 99-2001 era where everything happened at A) The docks B) Opera house C) Tropicana or D) Starcrust??

    Now you still have the small ones happenin at opera house.. etc .. but we also get the larger sponsored parties.

    As far as the 'underground' goes... BLA has still been kickin from what i hear... promise, too... Derek and I will be doin our usual summer outdoor party routine for the 3rd year.... and i'm sure when we all decide to stop someone else will jump up and do it..

    my .02 cents


    Dave <-- trying to get sponsored by Rev! ;)
  13. fleaflo

    fleaflo TRIBE Member

    Pffffffffffffffffffft, you feel that way cause you are a cheap, whored out skank. But I digress...:cool:
  14. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    To me, this is the perfect analogy of what happened to the rave scene in general. It became the coolest thing. And everyone wanted in. It's typical of the following that undeground movements historically have experienced.

    At first I hated the act taht the scene is changing. But then I started to accept that change happens. And if I don't change too, I'll be eating dust. So I'm not fighting it. I enjoy the big parties, the corporate sponsorship doens't have the Same Ol' feel to it, but it works. And there will always be the underground, smaller parties, the ones that are constantly running in the shadows. And that's part of running with that scene, you have to hide in the shadows with it, and constantly change, never being the same.

  15. MalGlo

    MalGlo TRIBE Member

    ya... what she said ^^^^^^^^
  16. tommysmalls

    tommysmalls TRIBE Member

    Re: Re: Corporate Sponsorship

    AMEN SISTA' !!!
  17. Lil'Timmy

    Lil'Timmy TRIBE Promoter

    The sminnoff experience was done with Jet Promotions, a toronto promotions company. They work togther right? I doubt smirnoff had any idea how to talk to the demograph, so the local promoter comes in and gives it that "tweaking" so to say to make it sweet for the partiers. Bottom line I guess is money talks, the big boys want in, all they need is some dough, and people will flock to see whoever big name comes to town because it's a big name I suppose....

    A name shouldn't make you want to party, music should. I was reminded long ago that you shouldn't party for the sake of partying, but for the music you're looking to enjoy. If the big name brought in by the big corporate giant plays the same music you like, then fuck go, who cares who sponsers it. Just don't give me that "you can only drink smirnoff" B.S. again.
  18. Rosey

    Rosey TRIBE Member

    i think it's naive or arrogant to spilt people into corporate whores & hardcores and accuse the whores of having no love for the scene.

    remember it's only been about 5 years since parties were good, after a 100 years of bad parties. that can't all change in a day, ya know?

    am i being a jerk? yes, yes i am. but i was pretty pissed off at the shot you took at me yesterday when i observed that equality would be nice. so :p to you.

    seriously though. there is no such thing as an underground three day event in an airport hotel. that is a big $$$$ corporate event. and as customers of a corporate event, people have a right to expect the product they paid for an the level of service implied in the promotion of the event. this is not comparable to the pseudo-underground parties that you named because they operate under a different premise. different things are offered and different things are expected.

    but appreciation of the different party types is not exclusive, in fact, they co-exist nicely. if i go to a beach party and the cops bust it, you won't catch me screaming at the promoter. because that's an accepted and understood risk of the event. if i go to a benson & hedges party (or the "Toronto Winter Music Conference") and the dj i paid to see doesn't show then i will scream to high heaven about how much B&H sucks, because they are completely different things.

    the SS crew is in a bad spot right now, and i feel for them. but that doesn't make the people who are angry about not getting the $50-60 party they paid for any less of a true believer in the scene. it is not the party-goers fault when a promoter bites-off more than they can chew
  19. Eclipze

    Eclipze TRIBE Member

    "its not about the dj's...its about the vibe!" muah sorry
  20. MBoy

    MBoy TRIBE Member

    I went to a fucking MINT party on satruday night, and there was no corporate sponsor.

    Who needs a party for 15000 people anyway?
  21. TheLiquidFairy

    TheLiquidFairy TRIBE Member

    what else is new

    I go to parties/events etc for music I want to hear. Whether it be corporate-sponsored or not, I don't really care. Sure, corporate events are sometimes cheaper and there are usually more DJ's but it's not like it makes any difference to me. If you can't take the corporate ads and such don't look or don't go.

    It's all business one way or another. There are few promoters left out there that just throw parties to throw parties. The scene has obviously changed. I do wish I was around for when it was all more 'underground', but yes it has become much more mainstream for lack of a better word...everybody wants a piece.
    It's up to ourselves to just go for the music, the so-called vibe and atmosphere that once was and still is.

    This is one arguement though that will go on forever.

    I go to have fun, socialise, dance, but most importantly I go for the music because that's what it's all about.

  22. starr

    starr TRIBE Member

    maybe you're taking my words a little out of context rosey

    i'm not against corporate events at all, in fact i go to a lot of them.
    and i never said people that go to those events have no love for the scene.

    i was just trying to point out the death of "caring promoters" in this city.
    yes wintergalactic had sponsors, but not one running the show.
    i would have been very surprised to see logo's hanging from the ceiling at their next party.
    why? because they care...but people quickly forget that.

    i just wanted to remind all those "angry consumers" that when we can only have big parties put on by corporate sponsors there's a reason for that.

    um, i don't know what you're talking about there.
    people make the party, and sure some years are better than others, but i've had a great time partying. sure i only started in '97 so maybe i don't know so much...but i think parties are still good, corporate or underground.

    you're right about the idea that the "appreciation of the different party types is not exclusive". but wintergalactic was NOT sponsored by B&H or other people doing the majority of the work...it was a party thrown in the same spirit of underground parties by promoters that we know personally and party with.
    Of course this does not make them blame-free, but i was simply amazed at how quickly people are to judge and speculate and point fingers, BEFORE anything was done or decided upon.

    when someone tries to do something innovative and different, maybe we should try and support them and have a little faith...instead of expecting the worst from them. who knows how different this whole fiasco could have turned out if people had been a little less wary and a bit more optimistic.

    que sera sera
  23. R4V4G3D_SKU11S

    R4V4G3D_SKU11S TRIBE Member

    I don't care either way because there will always be an underground.
  24. deacon

    deacon TRIBE Member

    thank you..

    hey starr,

    just got back from or event in miami and i saw your postings...much respect sista starr!

    although throughout the whole wintergalactic fiasco, andre and i and the ss family had amazing intentions, the bottom line is that we fucked up..as someone said, we bit off more than we could chew and that is why there is no more sonic state or nick and andre.

    sooo man lessons were learned, like never leave your partner in one city, to do another party in a different city. i.e. miami.

    in regards to the coprorate sponsorship comments, i agree with some things and disagree with others...there really is nothing wrong with full corporate sponsorship as long as the marketing is more integrated, and not shoved down your throat.. a al a smirnoff. great party, but people were called for their opinions while they were still hung over..

    i think it will be very interesting to see what happens sponsorship wise with wemf or the other like 8 huge parties happening...massive corporations from europe will be attempting events here very soon..we'll see what startegy they take.

    so there is my two cents...yes we at sonic state stayed true to our hearts, but we did not have the pockets like the cigarette companies of the world..no names :)

    thanks to everyone that came out support our events over the last 2 years...and so an era ends.

    now its time to face reality as i am getting a job abroad to pay off my debts and then there may be a state 02....and yes it will be sponsored...

    much respect to you all.

    nick aka deacon
    sonicstate@onebox.com :)
  25. AshG

    AshG Member

    i think its also more difficult to arrange a truly free gathering these days, a la DIY style in england.
    i mean, take a look at the way we communicate today (message boards such as this one), and the limitations that this medium places on how and what we communicate.
    Say i wanted to organize a free party and tell everyone about it.
    Could i do it here?
    Nope - not allowed to, unless i also go to the trouble of printing flyers and making sure those flyers have tribe logos on it.
    So to ask a slightly different, but related question: what is the role of tribe (or message boards like this) in propogating or curtailing the organization of real DIY parties? Does the medium in which we communicate help or hinder the proliferation of the underground? How?

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