CDJ discussion: Is there a club standard yet?

[adorablehomeboy]

Saw Erick Morillo @ the Guv, he used cds only. I'm 99% sure he used Pioneers.

Then there's the Denon version, and Technics.

What are the different capabilities between them? I know with the Denon's
you can read in an entire track into the player, then play a disc on top.

And how much $$ are they? (heard the Techs are $bling bling$)

Please discuss.

 

[Jeremy Jive]

I believe the standard is called the Technics 1200 turntable.

Most clubs have shit ass cd players. Therefore I've never even contemplated learning to use one. Plus I find the pitch to be waaay to sensitive.

jeremy -cdj1000 or nothing- jive

 

[oeretS]

Any proper club would use the Pio as the standard, not necessarily deservedly so, but they were the first to release a good table top player with a big responsive platter.

I bought the Denon S5000 cause its better for bedroom mixing (more featues = fun) , but I've learned how to use the CDJ1000 for gigs and its good too. Try one out and pick your fav.

btw the high end CDJ's range in the $1500-2K range brand new

 

[adorablehomeboy]

Originally posted by Jeremy
I believe the standard is called the Technics 1200 turntable.

Most clubs have shit ass cd players. Therefore I've never even contemplated learning to use one. Plus I find the pitch to be waaay to sensitive.

OK, let me be more clear

IS THERE A CDJ CLUB STANDARD YET???

and yes, I don't think you'll ever replace the turntable, but still....

adorable -IS THERE A CDJ CLUB STANDARD YET???- homeboy

 

[DJ_Science]

I don't know if there is a standard yet but most of the big club jocks i've seen live have been using Pioneer CDJ-1000's

 

[diablo]

Playing an entire set from CDs is fucking lame. You might as well mix the set in Protools and just burn it to CD beforehand.

 

[sohaness]

how is that lame??

steve.

 

[why not]

Originally posted by diablo
Playing an entire set from CDs is fucking lame. You might as well mix the set in Protools and just burn it to CD beforehand.

whatever.

i play vinyl and love it, but that is a ridiculous statement.

one that makes me believe you couldn't mix two tracks on a CDJ or on a Pro Tools rig.

 

[diablo]

Originally posted by sohaness
how is that lame??

Several reasons.

1. Since CDJs have a digital pitch display, a DJ can basically memorize or write down the pitch to mix each song at, thereby removing any skill at mixing tunes on the fly.

2. It removes any real "performance" from the DJs set. You can't juggle, scratch, etc with CDJs (or at least I've never seen any DJ do it).

3. Some may disagree, but I'd say that it brings down the quality of music that a DJ will play. Not everyone will invest in pressing even limited copies of a tune, or even cutting a dubplate unless they think that the tune is hype. However, anyone will spend 99 cents on a CDR. It encourages a "Why not?" mentality for tunes. Not all DJs will fall into this trap, but many will.

 

[Syntax Error]

you dj's are fucking idiots.

 

[The Tesseract]

the Tech CDJ's are ass.




Answer: NO THERE IS NOT A STANDARD
If you were to get close to a standard, it'd be the Pioneer CDJ-100's (not the 1000's) because they have all the typical features, and are pretty durable and cheap.

 

[why not]

Originally posted by diablo
Several reasons.

1. Since CDJs have a digital pitch display, a DJ can basically memorize or write down the pitch to mix each song at, thereby removing any skill at mixing tunes on the fly.

what about mixers with BPM calculators? besides, what you're describing could just as easily be done with turntables, the fact is no one is going to bother because it wouldn't really help you.

Originally posted by diablo

2. It removes any real "performance" from the DJs set. You can't juggle, scratch, etc with CDJs (or at least I've never seen any DJ do it).

every world famous DJ i've interviewed that uses CDs says that they can do more with a good CDJ deck - you can loop on the fly, re-trigger from a cue point, scratch, juggle, anything you want really.
the only thing you can do on a turntable that you can't do on a CDJ deck is drag the needle against the record.

Originally posted by diablo

3. Some may disagree, but I'd say that it brings down the quality of music that a DJ will play. Not everyone will invest in pressing even limited copies of a tune, or even cutting a dubplate unless they think that the tune is hype. However, anyone will spend 99 cents on a CDR. It encourages a "Why not?" mentality for tunes. Not all DJs will fall into this trap, but many will.

in the early days of house, demo tapes were an integral part of how the music evolved. no one was going to put money into pressing it on vinyl or even dubplate until it was proven on the dancefloor.
any underground club in the 80s had a reel to reel tape deck that DJs would mix with vinyl. if this wasn't part of the culture, those experimental "Why Not?" tracks that later became house would never have gotten to vinyl.

at the end of the day, if the crowd doesn't like the DJ, he/she won't get gigs. doesn't matter if he's playing only rare disco classics, or his own beats he made on fruity loops and burned to CD.

 

[oeretS]

One big problem with CDJ's is not the player itself, but the DJ's who burn mp3's to play out without mastering or checking the quality and bitrate. On big systems, its very obvious, bad low end, shreiky hi

 

[oeretS]

Originally posted by The Tesseract

Answer: NO THERE IS NOT A STANDARD

not true. Maybe bars who don't care would likely get a dual deck like a Denon or something cheaper, but any proper nightclub booking international DJ's etc use the Pio CDJ1000 without a doubt.

 

[ian]

Originally posted by diablo
Several reasons.

1. Since CDJs have a digital pitch display, a DJ can basically memorize or write down the pitch to mix each song at, thereby removing any skill at mixing tunes on the fly.

2. It removes any real "performance" from the DJs set. You can't juggle, scratch, etc with CDJs (or at least I've never seen any DJ do it).

3. Some may disagree, but I'd say that it brings down the quality of music that a DJ will play. Not everyone will invest in pressing even limited copies of a tune, or even cutting a dubplate unless they think that the tune is hype. However, anyone will spend 99 cents on a CDR. It encourages a "Why not?" mentality for tunes. Not all DJs will fall into this trap, but many will.

Some of these points were arguably correct several years ago. None of these points are true now.

-ian g.

 

[Dirtymatt]

Erick Morillo has it weritten into his contract that the club must have CDj1000s and if no then he wont play. Xpress 2 have been using CDJ1000s for a while now too and it seems to be the norm back in England for sure.

They are pretty good and you can scratch with them- basically can do the same as with vinyl. Times change, music must do to, and so therefore will the format you use.

matt

 

[ian]

The club standard is the Pioneer CDJ 1000s. This is what you will find in the riders of the big DJs that use CDs on occasion. The other manufactuors would like to have the market position that Pioneer does but they are not there yet.

These support scratching and much more.

-ian g.

 

[coleridge]

In the past year Pioneer CDJ-1000 has become the industry standard. Many many DJs just don't bother with vinyl anymore, because 90% of the stuff they play isn't on vinyl yet. And who's going to spend $100 to get an acetate cut these days? Big DJs who used to refuse to touch CD players are all now rocking the CDJ-1000.

If I travelled more I'd definitely give up vinyl and just rip everything to CDRs. Why haul around a flight case when you can just bring a CD book?

Sound quality is definitely an issue. On a good sound system CDs can sound terrible especially a system that doesn't have seperate EQ for each channel (which unfortunately seems to be the best systems out there)

Write down the pitch to mix each track? Mixing is not hard, there would be no use. It would be like writing down the sequence of gear shifts you need to drive to work. Perhaps when you're first learning to drive it would make sense ... but once you get the hang of it, it would be a waste of time.

 

[oeretS]

There was a great discussion on another board which exposed a growing problem with CDJ culture.

Basically, promos and CDR's are such the norm these days (check any DJ's top 10 chart) and can be spread so fast that the big exciting tracks lose lots of steam well before they even get released.

By the time they hit the record shelves, its old news cause Farina and co have been bangin that shit for like a year already, and you've got it on 2 mix sets at home. not so exciting to hear anymore. Record labels end up suffering big time because of this, but unfortunately its a tedious process to get a track signed, pressed and distributed.

 

[octo]

Originally posted by The Tesseract
the Tech CDJ's are ass.

you've tried them?


From the Panasonic website

-o-

Technics’ DJ SYSTEM goes digital
with new SL-DZ1200 Direct-Drive digital turntable
and SH-MZ1200 DJ mixer


ANAHEIM, Calif. (January 15, 2004) ¾ Known for their quality and durability, Technics SL-1200 series turntables have been a favorite of professional DJs who demand high-performance equipment for optimum creative expression. Now Technics extends this reputation into the digital era with the introduction of the SL-DZ1200 Direct-Drive Digital Turntable with SD Memory Card slot and the SH-MZ1200 DJ Mixer with four-channel play mode and other digital features.

"Technics has kept at the forefront of audio technology by introducing legendary changes in the industry, ” says Jim Kiczek, national marketing manager for Technics turntable products. "That reputation continues with the new digital turntable and matching DJ mixer designed specifically for professional DJs.”

The new digital turntable allows DJs to play several music formats, including CD-DA, AAC, and MP3. To add to the DJ's performance, the new unit allows sampled data to be digitally stored on a removable and reusable SD Memory Card — a feature that offers high-speed data access, huge storage capacity, and super portability. With the postage stamp-sized card, DJs can transport their music from one location to another or even download music samples* on their personal computer.

Turntable highlights include:

· Outstanding vibration resistance due to a rugged aluminum die cast upper cabinet with large double spring insulator feet and a tough CD mechanism.

· Seamless, instant cueing with four cue pads and memory for 10 cue points per an individual digital media such as a CD or SD Memory Card.

· A traditional platter-edge strobe with a digital readout (BPM, play position, etc.), variable-range (+8 to +50) and a reset button, "Pitch Lock" (the ability to change the tempo without changing pitch), and "Reverse-Forward" mode.



Additionally, the SL-DZ1200 turntable has a vinyl sound simulator, sample pads, dynamic effects, platter Free Wheel (a feature not available on jog-wheel type CD players), adjustable braking rate and a selectable display angle to permit use of the deck in upright hip-hop style. A Direct Drive motor system — offered first in the market by Technics to replace belt drive systems — has a quartz crystal control to provide accurate turntable speed.

The new digital turntable offers start-up speed options: a quick start-up time to full speed, making it possible to achieve extremely tight cueing, and a standard start-up characteristic of analog turntables. The unit also features a distinctive slip surface on the platter that allows for "scratching."

A perfect companion for the new turntable is the SH-MZ1200 DJ mixer. The new DJ mixer features a unique four-channel play mode feature, which provides surround sound at venues by assigning each track to Right/Left or Front/Rear. The SH-MZ1200 digital mixer is fully equipped with 12 inputs (CD x 2, Line x 3, Phono x 3, Mic x 2, Digital x 2) and 7 outputs. (Master x 3, Headphone x 1, Monitor x 1, Recording x 1, Digital x 1) Each channel has its own 3-band equalizer with –24dB (12dB/oct) attenuation.

Five self-illuminating Cue buttons select from four source channels and the effects channel, with Monitor Mixing knob and Mono Split Mode for headphone monitoring. Effects controls include level adjustment, Send and Return, a Pre/Post switch and individual effect On/Off switches for each channel.

Other features include:

· An optical Cross Fader, which uses microprocessor controlled VCA technology for extended service life and has three types of curves.

· Left/Right Split for independent fader and equalizer control over the left and right stereo channels.

· Separate Out to send Channel 1 or 2 to the front speakers, and Channel 3 or 4 to rear speakers.

· Fader-triggered start-stop for digital turntables, two digital inputs, and reverse selectors for all faders.



Technics turntables are marketed in the United States by Panasonic Consumer Electronics Company.

available april 2004 msrp $1199.95US

http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_electronics/pressroom/cont2.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=600

pictures
http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_e...nt4.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=595&media_type_id=1
http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_e...nt4.asp?Filter=12&cont_id=596&media_type_id=1

 

[oeretS]

you're posting an promotional ad, not a testimonial or objective opnion. They can talk as much as they want about it, still could be "ass".

 

[octo]

i'm not endorsing the techs. i just posted some info.

 

[Lofty]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by diablo
Several reasons.

1. Since CDJs have a digital pitch display, a DJ can basically memorize or write down the pitch to mix each song at, thereby removing any skill at mixing tunes on the fly.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

so when I write the BPM of a track on a record does that remove my Dj Skills?


---------

To come back against some ofthe other points..

- You can juggle,scratch, back spin,platter break... on the pioneers.

-vinyl Dj's get limited copies of music and dub plates - while it is true - I've also recieved test copies of music on CD BEFORE they go to dub plates or vinyl .

-if I make my own track, custom cut vinyl is $100 or I can burn it to CD for the 25¢ a blank cd it...

--------------------------------------
To state - I AM a vinyl junkie!!! I generally bring 3-6 crates of music to gigs BUT I also bring 500+ CD.
------------------------------------

Mixing skills ARE NOT determined by the equipment but the person using it. It is easier to mix with vinyl BUT you can also run seamless mixes with professional CD players. Just remember back in the 70's DJ's could 'beatmix' disco on turntables that had NO pitch control.....


The main advantage of CD's is with international DJ's. Ever try to get a crate of records across a border or on a plane? it's NOT easy. BUT if have your set on CD and you get less hassles.

as for Club standard - I think it's pioneer. (mind you they usually have denon rack mount cd players in the set-up too)

 

[Stan]

Originally posted by diablo
1. Since CDJs have a digital pitch display, a DJ can basically memorize or write down the pitch to mix each song at, thereby removing any skill at mixing tunes on the fly.

Beatmatching is the *easiest* part of being a DJ. Only a retard or an utter newb would have to resort to writing down the pitch to mix each song at. And it would only work if you knew exactly what songs you wanted to play and the exact order you wanted to play them in.

 

[diablo]

Originally posted by Stan
Beatmatching is the *easiest* part of being a DJ. Only a retard or an utter newb would have to resort to writing down the pitch to mix each song at. And it would only work if you knew exactly what songs you wanted to play and the exact order you wanted to play them in.

Well, there are several levels of beatmatching. There's Richie-Hawtin-six-crates-of-gear-down-to1/1000th-of-a-beat beatmatching, Andy-C-very-tight beatmatching, and gino-club-DJ-loose-as-hell beatmatching.

And, if songs are beatmatched well, every song in a set will play at the same speed, so you can play the songs in any order you want.

All that I'm saying is that, at least for me, there is some "performance" element to seeing a DJ live. Otherwise, why not just buy a mix CD? He'll use software to mix it absoluely perfectly, and you can listen to it anytime. For me, a set spun from all CDs takes a bit away from the performance.