1. Hi Guest: Welcome to TRIBE, Toronto's largest and longest running online community. If you'd like to post here, or reply to existing posts on TRIBE, you first have to register on the forum. You can register with your facebook ID or with an email address. Join us!

Apple <> Adobe clash escalating

Discussion in 'Technology' started by alexd, May 13, 2010.

  1. alexd

    alexd Administrator Staff Member

    Adobe's row with Apple over Flash technology escalates

    By Jonathan Fildes, BBC Technology reporter.

    Adobe has launched its latest salvo in an ongoing dispute with Apple.

    The co-founders of Adobe have published an open letter in which they say that Apple threatens to "undermine the next chapter of the web".

    The software firm has also started an adverting blitz in newspapers and on popular technology news sites.

    Some of the online adverts contain the tongue-in-cheek slogan "We heart Apple".

    It follows a letter from Apple boss Steve Jobs in which he defended his firm's decision not to allow Adobe's Flash technology on many of its popular products.

    Mr Jobs described Adobe's software - used on many websites for video and animations - as a "closed system" and "100% proprietary".

    "While Adobe's Flash products are widely available, this does not mean they are open, since they are controlled entirely by Adobe and available only from Adobe."

    Whilst Mr Jobs admitted that Apple also had "many proprietary products", he said that Apple believed "all standards pertaining to the web should be open".

    Amongst other criticisms, he also said Flash performed poorly when used on touchscreen smartphones and handheld devices.

    Adobe co-founders Chuck Geschke and John Warnock have now hit back.

    "We believe that consumers should be able to freely access their favorite content and applications, regardless of what computer they have, what browser they like, or what device suits their needs," the letter reads.

    "No company - no matter how big or how creative - should dictate what you can create, how you create it, or what you can experience on the web."

    Adobe's campaign is the latest move in a high-profile war of words between the two companies, which began with Apple's decision not to allow Flash technology to run on some of its popular gadgets such as the iPhone and iPad.

    But Flash is commonly used to build smartphone apps. As a result, developers commonly used automatic translation tools - some built by Adobe - to convert Flash code to run on Apple gadgets.

    These allowed developers to make applications once and then distribute them for use on various phones and operating systems, including Apple's iPhone.

    But in April, Apple changed the terms and conditions of the licence that software developers must sign, banning them from using these tools.

    Mr Jobs justified the decision in his letter by saying that experience had shown that the tools resulted in "sub-standard apps".

    The change effectively forced developers to build two separate applications - one for Apple products and one for everything else.

    Adobe CEO Shantanu Narayen described Mr Job's letter as a "smokescreen" and said the decision had made it "cumbersome" for developers who were forced to have "two workflows".

    The new letter from the co-founders of Adobe attacks Mr Jobs' assertion that Flash is a closed system.

    "As the founders of Adobe, we believe open markets are in the best interest of developers, content owners, and consumers."

    "If the web fragments into closed systems, if companies put content and applications behind walls, some indeed may thrive - but their success will come at the expense of the very creativity and innovation that has made the internet a revolutionary force.

    The company claims that its software- and particularly Flash - is open.

    "We publish the specifications for Flash — meaning anyone can make their own Flash player," it reads.

    "We believe that Apple, by taking the opposite approach, has taken a step that could undermine this next chapter of the web - the chapter in which mobile devices outnumber computers, any individual can be a publisher, and content is accessed anywhere and at any time.

    "In the end, we believe the question is really this: Who controls the world wide web? And we believe the answer is: nobody — and everybody, but certainly not a single company."

    The letter has been published on the Adobe website as part of a global advertising campaign.

    The adverts list a series of technologies that Adobe says it "loves".

    It ends: "What we don't love is anybody taking away your freedom to choose what you create, how you create it, and what you experience on the web."

    The adverts have been bought in the New York Times, Washington Post, San Francisco Chronicle as well as the Financial Times and Wall Street Journal. Online, they appear on Wired, Techcrunch and Engadget.

    Apple did not have an immediate response to the campaign.
  2. acheron

    acheron TRIBE Member

  3. dig this

    dig this TRIBE Member

    i don't get it... if apple doesn't like flash then they don't have to accept it in their products. If the the consumer wants flash, then don't buy apple.
  4. acheron

    acheron TRIBE Member

    the argument is on the developer's side - they know they have to have products on Apple's platform because Apple's products are so popular. Apple, who have more or less proven that maintaining standards and a consistent message are key to brand identity, have declared that Flash is no longer welcome on their platform because let's face it, it's easy to develop for but it's also for shit because there are too many outs for developers to make something that works just enough, but really, doesn't run efficiently and may very well slow down the device it's running on. Apple is telling developers to pull up their socks. They're also telling Adobe to make Flash a better product. Developers are all waaaaaa because now they have to actually work to make a decent product, if they want access to Apple's userbase. Users = win out of this. Developers, well... it's really up to them. I love seeing those arguments, "oooh apple's gonna hurt when we stop making apps for their flash-hating platform", right. Sure. The iphone (non-flash) platform has been really suffering from their non-flash developing protest.
  5. dig this

    dig this TRIBE Member

    that's pretty much what I figured... It could potentially back fire on Apple, however quite unlikely... So if there's any truth to what Apple is saying about Adobe's inferior product, then Adobe has to step it up.
  6. acheron

    acheron TRIBE Member

    The question here is money. Flash developers want money, and they want Apple users' money. Apple is stopping them from getting money, so they are complaining. Adobe is complaining too 'cuz it's going to hit them in developer's fees, their product is being called out, doesn't look good.

    If you've used Flash on the web, which you very likely have, you probably know the difference between a well-written app and a poorly written one. I can't count the number of times I've had a browser crash because of some fucked up banner ad or a memory leak or whatever, most of it being due to some shitty flash app. Java's a close second for this.
  7. PAUZE

    PAUZE TRIBE Promoter

    This is a big brawl. I hope to see flash on the iphone onen day. However I did see that Dell is coming out with some handsets with it soon.....
  8. jazzsax

    jazzsax TRIBE Member

    I cut the full page ad out from the globe and mail today and taped it up in the window of the marketing managers office.

    Their whole team uses apples, home, work, everywhere, and even they are up in arms. They think the ad campaign is brilliant though...

    Not like it's going to matter, flash support won't be comin!
  9. Eclectic

    Eclectic TRIBE Member

    Didn't Jobs get quoted saying "Flash will be dead within a year" recently on Twitter?

    I would check but I'm at work.

    Stupid firewall.
  10. oddmyth

    oddmyth TRIBE Member

    If flash10.1 drops in June and is the bees knees then I will be happy that:

    1. Steve Jobs actually whipped Adobe into FINALLY putting out a decent version of Flash.

    2. All this handwringing will FINALLY be over and Adobe's squeeze move to get Flash on the iPhone won't even matter.

    Most of what is being written about this situation is such pure unadulterated ballwash that I feel like punching all the flag wavers in either camp.
  11. basilisk

    basilisk TRIBE Member

    I never liked Flash but I loathe how much of the web I can't access on my phone because of this dick move.

    Oh, right, don't buy Apple. Should have listened to myself.
  12. Dialog

    Dialog TRIBE Member

    Appleinsider: Adobe-Apple war on Flash reminiscent of PostScript struggle

    Little bit of history for y'all... not many people here remember the Eighties. There are a few dubious statements on page 3 but the article does raise one point seldom addressed by the haters: how long has Adobe been promising Mobile Flash (not Flash Lite)? Years. It is undeniable that this brouhaha is forcing Adobe to fuck off and finish the product... maybe even improve it!

    A long time ago, in a galaxy far far away, Illustrator was an enjoyable program to use. Then they shipped Illustrator 9 and it took about 5 years to get the program usable (hell... stable) again.

Share This Page