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Any PMPs on here?

exrboy

TRIBE Promoter
Yo yo yo,

I think I wanna go back to school part time in the fall to get my Project Management stuff. Anyone got any recommendations on where to go? I think I'll probably hit U of T or Rye high (if they let me in)

Werd.
 

JEMZ

TRIBE Member
I'm a P-I-M-P

I also have my PMP but did not get it in T.O so cannot reccommend in your neighbourhood.... good to have though, it is a big growth industry.
 

H2Whoa

TRIBE Member
Here also but do you really understand what the requirements are?

Eligibility

• Applicants must have 35 hours of specific project management education.
• With a Bachelor’s Degree (or the global equivalent): Applicants must have a minimum three years’ professional project management experience, during which 4,500 hours are spent leading and directing project tasks, up to eight years from the time of application.
• Without a Bachelor’s Degree (or the global equivalent): Applicants must have a minimum five years’ professional project management experience, during which at least 7,500 hours are spent leading and directing project tasks, up to eight years from the time of application.
 
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guysmiley

TRIBE Member
exrboy said:
I got most of that. :D Need more hours but I can lie about that can't I? ;)
You can, but:

1) That's unethical
2) The ISO-certfiied process to get your credential does include occasional audits
 

exrboy

TRIBE Promoter
So where'd you guys go to school for it? I've been told there's a fast track way of doing it but I don't wanna do that.
 

judge wopner

TRIBE Member
im just starting this, have my first course september 3rd, its 3 days of
stuff like "process mapping" "project creep" "project scope" , and lots of inverted triangles w/ mutiple groups in them and lines connecting them to boxes and diamond shaps.....

barf...
 

KickIT

TRIBE Member
I started down the PMP path but my prof even said it's not worth it (if you have PM experience). Join the PMI and then prep for your PMP on your own.
 
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Fillmore

TRIBE Member
exrboy said:
So where'd you guys go to school for it? I've been told there's a fast track way of doing it but I don't wanna do that.
This is what I have currently been working towards. I have one of the three courses complete but I have minimal hours.
Ive just applied for a job that will give me more hours as its a project type role. I could also use this job to finish the other two courses. (justify to the university where I work that they are related to my job)

I am not making this a priority career but if over the time of the next few years I can meet the requirements, I figure why not.


I did all my work at the Professional Development Centre which is a part of the Engineering Faculty at the University of Toronto. I beleive the first course cost around $3000.

Good luck!!!
 

KickIT

TRIBE Member
If you're looking to PM IT projects, PMP is almost useless. Traditional waterfall development is going out the door as more shops are going to Agile which requires a whole new way at looking at PM.
 

H2Whoa

TRIBE Member
i did my course hours through Global Knowledge and an employer paid for it. i just did they qualifying minimum.

the exam is nothing to scoff at. 35 people wrote it when i did and only 8 passed (including myself).
 

exrboy

TRIBE Promoter
I don't know if I wanna do it for IT. (although most of my project management shite is in IT) I think I wanna do some environmental PM stuff (that's what my degree is in)
 
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H2Whoa

TRIBE Member
KickIT said:
If you're looking to PM IT projects, PMP is almost useless. Traditional waterfall development is going out the door as more shops are going to Agile which requires a whole new way at looking at PM.
i agree with this and right now all I do is manage IT projects. however the PMP to me is simply my resume checkmark and not my font of applied project education and process.
 

zoo

TRIBE Member
exrboy said:
I don't know if I wanna do it for IT. (although most of my project management shite is in IT) I think I wanna do some environmental PM stuff (that's what my degree is in)
what kind of environmental PM do you want to do?

my better half is an enviro sci at an eng/enviro consulting firm, and technically she's a "project manager," although what that *really* means is that she schedules the project work before doing the project work herself :p
 

guysmiley

TRIBE Member
KickIT said:
If you're looking to PM IT projects, PMP is almost useless. Traditional waterfall development is going out the door as more shops are going to Agile which requires a whole new way at looking at PM.
Agile and Waterfall are methodologies. A good PM will continue to learn and develop their tools and skill-set as new ones become available and this is, in fact, a requirement of maintaining your PMP designation.

Also, adaptive project management is nothing new – Agile seems to be to IT PM work as Six Sigma is to quality management. Specifically; a re-work and collection of existing methodologies presented in an easily-digested manner with cute buzzwords. And it does work in many cases- especially in a software development environment (one could also argue, in any creative work).
 

H2Whoa

TRIBE Member
guysmiley said:
Agile and Waterfall are methodologies. A good PM will continue to learn and develop their tools and skill-set as new ones become available and this is, in fact, a requirement of maintaining your PMP designation.

Also, adaptive project management is nothing new – Agile seems to be to IT PM work as Six Sigma is to quality management. Specifically; a re-work and collection of existing methodologies presented in an easily-digested manner with cute buzzwords. And it does work in many cases- especially in a software development environment (one could also argue, in any creative work).
good points. you use what fits and if it meshes with the firm's culture. sometimes you get little choice and you have to make do.
 
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blueshrike

TRIBE Member
guysmiley said:
Agile and Waterfall are methodologies. A good PM will continue to learn and develop their tools and skill-set as new ones become available and this is, in fact, a requirement of maintaining your PMP designation.

Also, adaptive project management is nothing new – Agile seems to be to IT PM work as Six Sigma is to quality management. Specifically; a re-work and collection of existing methodologies presented in an easily-digested manner with cute buzzwords. And it does work in many cases- especially in a software development environment (one could also argue, in any creative work).

it is true that the various agiles are methodologies and there are lots of buzzwords. However agile is a different way of building software than waterfall. Just as Test Driven Development is a fundamentally different way of testing your software than whatever the other way of doing things is called. You are spot on that any good PM will adapt. Though I haven't yet worked in an agile shop that had a dedicated PM assigned to product development. Probably a good one could add value. Mostly what you need is close contact and a good relationship with the customer or a customer proxy. PM's are a more natural fit in professional services I think. But then in my experience, agile isn't really a great fit in professional services. You never make any money.

While not mutually exclusive, the PMI PM methodology as taught during the course offered by the PMI in preparation for the PMP exam is not consistent with the principles of agile development. (Having just taken that course last summer).

Of course, several of the instructors stated baldly that if you wanted to pass your PMP exam, forget everything you know about managing projects and focus on memorizing their methodology. The PMP exam material is mostly taken from the PMI's book ... PMBOK ... which describes a theoretically perfect project management methodology rather than anything particularly practical or economic. Unless maybe you are building the space shuttle.
 

416

TRIBE Member
I'm pretty sure PMP designations exist so that management will know by looking at your name if you can be safely fired when layoffs are necessary.
 

H2Whoa

TRIBE Member
416 said:
I'm pretty sure PMP designations exist so that management will know by looking at your name if you can be safely fired when layoffs are necessary.
lol

thats ok. most will have a nest egg big enough to carry them on to the next contract or job.
 

guysmiley

TRIBE Member
blueshrike said:
While not mutually exclusive, the PMI PM methodology as taught during the course offered by the PMI in preparation for the PMP exam is not consistent with the principles of agile development. (Having just taken that course last summer).
You definitely bring up some good points and I believe they capture the stigma associated with PM’s in general (a good portion of which may be founded)

Using the Scrum methodology under Agile, you have “Scrum Masters” which help facilitate daily meetings and maintain Product Backlogs, Sprint Backlogs, and the Burn Down chart. The entire Sprint is given a timebox and each meeting has a status check on tasks accomplished, tasks planned, and roadblocks. Looking at the PMBOK 5:

Initiating – Getting the Scrum team together and defining feature as a part of the whole
Planning – Product Owner putting Stories into the Product Backlog. Creating the Sprint Backlog
Executing – Coding the Sprint backlog
Controlling – Daily meetings, Burn-down, timeboxes
Closing – Burndown closeout, budget closeout, celebrating, next feature selection

The PMBOK itself states several times that the stages of the lifecycle can be iterative and may overlap. Just like any good MD doesn’t rely solely on the Physicians Desk Reference nor does any good CA rely solely on GAAP, good PM’s shouldn’t rely solely on the verbage in the PMBOK.

Where I do think there is a disconnect is that “traditionally” trained PM’s believe that each stage should be clearly defined (especially requirements/planning) and that ambiguity (defined as a change in project scope) is undesired (hence, practically in most projects, CR processes often discourage change). Engineers typically view these types of PM’s as bureaucracy bringing little value- especially when time they can spend coding is being tied up by requirement sign-offs and approvals. Any PM who does not utilize their resources to accomplish defined project goals as soon as they are available to do so is wasting time, IMO.
 
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