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another spying scandal

why not

TRIBE Member
it's been fun watching this unfold today:

NSA has massive database of Americans' phone calls

By Leslie Cauley, USA TODAY
Thu May 11, 7:21 AM ET

The National Security Agency has been secretly collecting the phone call records of tens of millions of Americans, using data provided by AT&T, Verizon and BellSouth, people with direct knowledge of the arrangement told USA TODAY.

The NSA program reaches into homes and businesses across the nation by amassing information about the calls of ordinary Americans - most of whom aren't suspected of any crime. This program does not involve the NSA listening to or recording conversations. But the spy agency is using the data to analyze calling patterns in an effort to detect terrorist activity, sources said in separate interviews.

QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS: The NSA record collection program

"It's the largest database ever assembled in the world," said one person, who, like the others who agreed to talk about the NSA's activities, declined to be identified by name or affiliation. The agency's goal is "to create a database of every call ever made" within the nation's borders, this person added.

For the customers of these companies, it means that the government has detailed records of calls they made - across town or across the country - to family members, co-workers, business contacts and others.

The three telecommunications companies are working under contract with the NSA, which launched the program in 2001 shortly after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, the sources said. The program is aimed at identifying and tracking suspected terrorists, they said.

The sources would talk only under a guarantee of anonymity because the NSA program is secret.

Air Force Gen. Michael Hayden, nominated Monday by President Bush to become the director of the CIA, headed the NSA from March 1999 to April 2005. In that post, Hayden would have overseen the agency's domestic call-tracking program. Hayden declined to comment about the program.

The NSA's domestic program, as described by sources, is far more expansive than what the White House has acknowledged. Last year, Bush said he had authorized the NSA to eavesdrop - without warrants - on international calls and international e-mails of people suspected of having links to terrorists when one party to the communication is in the USA. Warrants have also not been used in the NSA's efforts to create a national call database.

In defending the previously disclosed program, Bush insisted that the NSA was focused exclusively on international calls. "In other words," Bush explained, "one end of the communication must be outside the United States."

As a result, domestic call records - those of calls that originate and terminate within U.S. borders - were believed to be private.

Sources, however, say that is not the case. With access to records of billions of domestic calls, the NSA has gained a secret window into the communications habits of millions of Americans. Customers' names, street addresses and other personal information are not being handed over as part of NSA's domestic program, the sources said. But the phone numbers the NSA collects can easily be cross-checked with other databases to obtain that information.

Don Weber, a senior spokesman for the NSA, declined to discuss the agency's operations. "Given the nature of the work we do, it would be irresponsible to comment on actual or alleged operational issues; therefore, we have no information to provide," he said. "However, it is important to note that NSA takes its legal responsibilities seriously and operates within the law."

The White House would not discuss the domestic call-tracking program. "There is no domestic surveillance without court approval," said Dana Perino, deputy press secretary, referring to actual eavesdropping.

She added that all national intelligence activities undertaken by the federal government "are lawful, necessary and required for the pursuit of al-Qaeda and affiliated terrorists." All government-sponsored intelligence activities "are carefully reviewed and monitored," Perino said. She also noted that "all appropriate members of Congress have been briefed on the intelligence efforts of the United States."

The government is collecting "external" data on domestic phone calls but is not intercepting "internals," a term for the actual content of the communication, according to a U.S. intelligence official familiar with the program. This kind of data collection from phone companies is not uncommon; it's been done before, though never on this large a scale, the official said. The data are used for "social network analysis," the official said, meaning to study how terrorist networks contact each other and how they are tied together.

Carriers uniquely positioned

AT&T recently merged with SBC and kept the AT&T name. Verizon, BellSouth and AT&T are the nation's three biggest telecommunications companies; they provide local and wireless phone service to more than 200 million customers.

The three carriers control vast networks with the latest communications technologies. They provide an array of services: local and long-distance calling, wireless and high-speed broadband, including video. Their direct access to millions of homes and businesses has them uniquely positioned to help the government keep tabs on the calling habits of Americans.

Among the big telecommunications companies, only Qwest has refused to help the NSA, the sources said. According to multiple sources, Qwest declined to participate because it was uneasy about the legal implications of handing over customer information to the government without warrants.

Qwest's refusal to participate has left the NSA with a hole in its database. Based in Denver, Qwest provides local phone service to 14 million customers in 14 states in the West and Northwest. But AT&T and Verizon also provide some services - primarily long-distance and wireless - to people who live in Qwest's region. Therefore, they can provide the NSA with at least some access in that area.

Created by President Truman in 1952, during the Korean War, the NSA is charged with protecting the United States from foreign security threats. The agency was considered so secret that for years the government refused to even confirm its existence. Government insiders used to joke that NSA stood for "No Such Agency."

In 1975, a congressional investigation revealed that the NSA had been intercepting, without warrants, international communications for more than 20 years at the behest of the CIA and other agencies. The spy campaign, code-named "Shamrock," led to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA), which was designed to protect Americans from illegal eavesdropping.

Enacted in 1978, FISA lays out procedures that the U.S. government must follow to conduct electronic surveillance and physical searches of people believed to be engaged in espionage or international terrorism against the United States. A special court, which has 11 members, is responsible for adjudicating requests under FISA.

Over the years, NSA code-cracking techniques have continued to improve along with technology. The agency today is considered expert in the practice of "data mining" - sifting through reams of information in search of patterns. Data mining is just one of many tools NSA analysts and mathematicians use to crack codes and track international communications.

Paul Butler, a former U.S. prosecutor who specialized in terrorism crimes, said FISA approval generally isn't necessary for government data-mining operations. "FISA does not prohibit the government from doing data mining," said Butler, now a partner with the law firm Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld in Washington, D.C.

The caveat, he said, is that "personal identifiers" - such as names, Social Security numbers and street addresses - can't be included as part of the search. "That requires an additional level of probable cause," he said.

The usefulness of the NSA's domestic phone-call database as a counterterrorism tool is unclear. Also unclear is whether the database has been used for other purposes.

The NSA's domestic program raises legal questions. Historically, AT&T and the regional phone companies have required law enforcement agencies to present a court order before they would even consider turning over a customer's calling data. Part of that owed to the personality of the old Bell Telephone System, out of which those companies grew.

Ma Bell's bedrock principle - protection of the customer - guided the company for decades, said Gene Kimmelman, senior public policy director of Consumers Union. "No court order, no customer information - period. That's how it was for decades," he said.

The concern for the customer was also based on law: Under Section 222 of the Communications Act, first passed in 1934, telephone companies are prohibited from giving out information regarding their customers' calling habits: whom a person calls, how often and what routes those calls take to reach their final destination. Inbound calls, as well as wireless calls, also are covered.

The financial penalties for violating Section 222, one of many privacy reinforcements that have been added to the law over the years, can be stiff. The Federal Communications Commission, the nation's top telecommunications regulatory agency, can levy fines of up to $130,000 per day per violation, with a cap of $1.325 million per violation. The FCC has no hard definition of "violation." In practice, that means a single "violation" could cover one customer or 1 million.

In the case of the NSA's international call-tracking program, Bush signed an executive order allowing the NSA to engage in eavesdropping without a warrant. The president and his representatives have since argued that an executive order was sufficient for the agency to proceed. Some civil liberties groups, including the American Civil Liberties Union, disagree.

Companies approached

The NSA's domestic program began soon after the Sept. 11 attacks, according to the sources. Right around that time, they said, NSA representatives approached the nation's biggest telecommunications companies. The agency made an urgent pitch: National security is at risk, and we need your help to protect the country from attacks.

The agency told the companies that it wanted them to turn over their "call-detail records," a complete listing of the calling histories of their millions of customers. In addition, the NSA wanted the carriers to provide updates, which would enable the agency to keep tabs on the nation's calling habits.

The sources said the NSA made clear that it was willing to pay for the cooperation. AT&T, which at the time was headed by C. Michael Armstrong, agreed to help the NSA. So did BellSouth, headed by F. Duane Ackerman; SBC, headed by Ed Whitacre; and Verizon, headed by Ivan Seidenberg.

With that, the NSA's domestic program began in earnest.

AT&T, when asked about the program, replied with a comment prepared for USA TODAY: "We do not comment on matters of national security, except to say that we only assist law enforcement and government agencies charged with protecting national security in strict accordance with the law."

In another prepared comment, BellSouth said: "BellSouth does not provide any confidential customer information to the NSA or any governmental agency without proper legal authority."

Verizon, the USA's No. 2 telecommunications company behind AT&T, gave this statement: "We do not comment on national security matters, we act in full compliance with the law and we are committed to safeguarding our customers' privacy."

Qwest spokesman Robert Charlton said: "We can't talk about this. It's a classified situation."

In December, The New York Times revealed that Bush had authorized the NSA to wiretap, without warrants, international phone calls and e-mails that travel to or from the USA. The following month, the Electronic Frontier Foundation, a civil liberties group, filed a class-action lawsuit against AT&T. The lawsuit accuses the company of helping the NSA spy on U.S. phone customers.

Last month, U.S. Attorney General Alberto Gonzales alluded to that possibility. Appearing at a House Judiciary Committee hearing, Gonzales was asked whether he thought the White House has the legal authority to monitor domestic traffic without a warrant. Gonzales' reply: "I wouldn't rule it out." His comment marked the first time a Bush appointee publicly asserted that the White House might have that authority.

Similarities in programs

The domestic and international call-tracking programs have things in common, according to the sources. Both are being conducted without warrants and without the approval of the FISA court. The Bush administration has argued that FISA's procedures are too slow in some cases. Officials, including Gonzales, also make the case that the USA Patriot Act gives them broad authority to protect the safety of the nation's citizens.

The chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Sen. Pat Roberts (news, bio, voting record), R-Kan., would not confirm the existence of the program. In a statement, he said, "I can say generally, however, that our subcommittee has been fully briefed on all aspects of the Terrorist Surveillance Program. ... I remain convinced that the program authorized by the president is lawful and absolutely necessary to protect this nation from future attacks."

The chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, Rep. Pete Hoekstra, R-Mich., declined to comment.

One company differs

One major telecommunications company declined to participate in the program: Qwest.

According to sources familiar with the events, Qwest's CEO at the time, Joe Nacchio, was deeply troubled by the NSA's assertion that Qwest didn't need a court order - or approval under FISA - to proceed. Adding to the tension, Qwest was unclear about who, exactly, would have access to its customers' information and how that information might be used.

Financial implications were also a concern, the sources said. Carriers that illegally divulge calling information can be subjected to heavy fines. The NSA was asking Qwest to turn over millions of records. The fines, in the aggregate, could have been substantial.

The NSA told Qwest that other government agencies, including the FBI, CIA and DEA, also might have access to the database, the sources said. As a matter of practice, the NSA regularly shares its information - known as "product" in intelligence circles - with other intelligence groups. Even so, Qwest's lawyers were troubled by the expansiveness of the NSA request, the sources said.

The NSA, which needed Qwest's participation to completely cover the country, pushed back hard.

Trying to put pressure on Qwest, NSA representatives pointedly told Qwest that it was the lone holdout among the big telecommunications companies. It also tried appealing to Qwest's patriotic side: In one meeting, an NSA representative suggested that Qwest's refusal to contribute to the database could compromise national security, one person recalled.

In addition, the agency suggested that Qwest's foot-dragging might affect its ability to get future classified work with the government. Like other big telecommunications companies, Qwest already had classified contracts and hoped to get more.

Unable to get comfortable with what NSA was proposing, Qwest's lawyers asked NSA to take its proposal to the FISA court. According to the sources, the agency refused.

The NSA's explanation did little to satisfy Qwest's lawyers. "They told (Qwest) they didn't want to do that because FISA might not agree with them," one person recalled. For similar reasons, this person said, NSA rejected Qwest's suggestion of getting a letter of authorization from the U.S. attorney general's office. A second person confirmed this version of events.

In June 2002, Nacchio resigned amid allegations that he had misled investors about Qwest's financial health. But Qwest's legal questions about the NSA request remained.

Unable to reach agreement, Nacchio's successor, Richard Notebaert, finally pulled the plug on the NSA talks in late 2004, the sources said.
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why not

TRIBE Member
the arrogance of this administration is impressive:

Bush denies report of spying on Americans
By Demetri Sevastopulo in Washington
2 hours, 7 minutes ago

President George W. Bush on Thursday took the rare step of publicly denying that his administration was spying on Americans, after a media report claimed the National Security Agency was collecting the phone records of tens of millions of Americans.

USA Today reported that AT&T, Verizon (NYSE:VZ - news) and BellSouth have been providing the NSA with the phone records of more than 200m Americans for the purpose of allowing the ultra-secret surveillance agency to analyse calling patterns. A senior US official vouched for the report, saying it was accurate as far as he was aware. But he stressed that the administration believed collecting phone records was legal.

"We're not mining or trolling through the personal lives of millions of innocent Americans," Mr Bush said in a brief statement to reporters. "Our efforts are focused on links to al-Qaeda and their known affiliates."

USA Today said Qwest refused to co-operate with the NSA because of concerns that the programme was illegal. Mr Bush denied approving any illegal intelligence programmes and stressed: "The privacy of ordinary Americans is fiercely protected."

The president on Thursday repeated his mantra on the danger of media leaks, in spite of the fact that Lewis "Scooter" Libby - Vice-President Dick Cheney's former chief of staff, who has been indicted for allegedly lying to prosecutors investigating the outing of a covert CIA agent - claimed in court documents Mr Bush authorised the leaking of sensitive intelligence on Iraq.

"As a general matter, every time sensitive intelligence is leaked, it hurts our ability to defeat this enemy," Mr Bush said.

Thursday's revelation follows a New York Times report late last year that Mr Bush authorised the warrantless eavesdropping on the international communications of Americans where one party was suspected of having links to al-Qaeda or other terrorist organisations.

The disclosure of another controversial NSA programme comes as the White House lobbies Congress to approve its choice of General Michael Hayden, the deputy director of national intelligence who headed the NSA from 1999 to 2005, to replace Porter Goss, fired as director of the CIA last week.

Democrats leapt on the revelation, which came on the same day the Justice department shut down an investigation into the domestic spying programme after its investigators could not get the necessary security clearances.

"It is very disturbing that, on the same day we learn that the NSA has been secretly collecting the phone records of tens of millions of Americans, we also learn that the Department of Justice has abruptly cancelled its investigation into the agency's warrantless wiretapping programme," said John Conyers, the top Democrat on the House judiciary committee.

Arlen Specter, chairman of the Senate judiciary committee and one of the rare Republican critics of the domestic spying programme, said he would call on the executives of the telephone companies to testify about the latest allegations. Other Republicans defended the NSA effort to obtain phone records, saying it was necessary to protect the US from terror attacks.
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Boss Hog said:
a blowjob!

nah tried that on the last guy and he managed to get away with it.

Honestly its time to stop focusing on a lame duck president who isn't worth tossing out before he has to leave by default. We need to start ripping apart the republican party from the inside and create a schism between the religous chistian morons and the republican party.


TRIBE Member
Ditto Much said:
nah tried that on the last guy and he managed to get away with it.

Honestly its time to stop focusing on a lame duck president who isn't worth tossing out before he has to leave by default. We need to start ripping apart the republican party from the inside and create a schism between the religous chistian morons and the republican party.

hey, not all christians are morons. there's alot of sketches in this world that aren't christian. I could probably name at least 50 on this board. :p

Boss Hog

TRIBE Member
Ditto Much said:
nah tried that on the last guy and he managed to get away with it.

Yeah but it's hilarious how they'd take a guy to court for lying over a blowjob, but not about lying about the reasons they took a country to war.

Nothing that hasn't been said before.

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
jazzsax said:
hey, not all christians are morons. there's alot of sketches in this world that aren't christian. I could probably name at least 50 on this board. :p

true but without the support of the christian right wing the republicans wouldn't stand a chance.
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Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
Boss Hog said:
Yeah but it's hilarious how they'd take a guy to court for lying over a blowjob, but not about lying about the reasons they took a country to war.

Stories of dick sucking are fun for all parties involved, we all get to call some chick we don't know a fat skank, we get to call some president we actually like a sleezy old man and we all feel good afterwards. The whole war thing sucks we have dead bodies who will cease to be heros if the war they faught become unheroic Vietnam is a great example of this.


TRIBE Member
Its disgusting how they are spending huge amounts of money on a database that I believe will mainly be used for blackmail. Like, oh you want to run for political office? well we have a record of you calling a suspected drug dealer 20 years ago, hmm what does that say about your chances? And then using this tool under the guise of the war on terror. Its cliche to mention Orwell but the americans are living 1984 currently. It reminds me of this poster I saw that had a dude in a military uniform with a republican badge, with the slogan underneath, its not facism if we are the ones doing it.

Its astonishing too that there are now reports that 2/3rds of americans dont mind being monitored on. Woah, where the hell did they get all that kool-aid to brainwash these sheep? Osama succeeded in his mission, although it has been america that has done most of the damage to itself, he just set it in motion. I also predict, (although its not profound in any sense) that this story will be in the news for the next week or so, then the mainstream media will become bored with it, and they will move to the next story, without any impact on any noticable change to what has happened.

I wonder, is there any similar program happening here in Canada? Does Harper have any plans to implement something similar? It would be waay easier here, since we have less phone companies and a smaller population. I hope not.

Ditto Much

TRIBE Member
2/3 of people who were able to answer a phonecall at 7pm at night and bothered to hear it. Those people know damn well that the dirt on there neighbors and the people they dislike is worse than thier own dirt.
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TRIBE Member
wow - so those are the kinds of jobs that losers who specialize in research methods end up doing!

"Hello, I'm John, I've never seen tits...but I can sort out your independent variables real good"