Racism in Canda Towards Native Canadians

Discussion in 'TRIBE Main Forum' started by swilly, Jan 23, 2002.

  1. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    History has taught us that isolating people of one group, into one group and maintaining that, perpetuates bad situations....

    Rosey: I have a question about the teaching thing. If they are being taught by natives, which I'm not sure of, then the medication argument doens't really make sense to me. I mean, if it's a request made by their own people, and not the government, then how is that oppresive?

  2. matty

    matty TRIBE Member

    Point blank, Regent Park is a 5 star resort compared to some of the communities I've been.
  3. fleaflo

    fleaflo TRIBE Member

    To be treated as a human being with the same rights and opportunities as others. You can take all the rest of that crap back and shove it up your fat fucking ass Poindexter.
  4. Ditto Much

    Ditto Much TRIBE Member

    Sorry the time machine hasn't yet been invented. We simply can't undo our past/

    I can't make people have respect for another group. I can treat them as best as I can, I can respect their culture and their beliefs personally but I can't force another persons mind to work the way I want it too.

    They control there own industry and there own education. We can't take away there kids, we can't go in and build our cultures recreation centres. They have to help themselves and we have to provide them the resources to do this. If we go back and tell them how to raise there kids and how to educate there kids and how to run there business's we're repeateing the same mistake that created the problem.

    They control they're own education system!!! We are not here to play god and we're not here to tell them what they should and shouldn't teach there children. Thats what got us in this problem in the first place. We can't expect to move forward by repeating the same mistakes.
    But they need to administer there own territory and there own society. If they don't have oppertunity they need to create it. We can help them to create it, we can give them access to our resources to help them create it. We can partner with them to create it. But we can't pay them off anymore. They have to run there own society and they have to define there own culture.

    Our past wrong doings are numerous, but we can't take back the past.

    I don't agree with treating anyone like a second class citizen. The natives need to solve there problems, we need to help them by providing access to our resources.
  5. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    Maybe, but I think we understand each other's point.
  6. Rosey

    Rosey TRIBE Member

    not talking about native run schools, talking about community schools that are attended by all area residents. our education system no longer segregates natives.
  7. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    mingster, i haven't understood any of your points in this thread.
  8. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    What don't you understand?
    I'd be happy to explain myself.
  9. Ditto Much

    Ditto Much TRIBE Member

    Wow really how did I insult you so much with what I wrote. Are you sure I'm being so rude in what I'm saying. Please read back over what I'm saying.

    To be treated like a human being with the same rights and oppertunities as others is what we're trying to accomplish. We have fucked up the past and we got it wrong but we can't change that. Going into there territories and telling them how to run it is just repeating our past mistakes. We need to allow them to govern themselves as much as possible, and this means that if they in this process make a step backwards as we have on several occasions we can't treat them like children and try to prevent it. We need to allow them more than just individual rights and freedoms, we need to allow there culture to develop on its own. And sometimes we're not going to like what we see.

    Honestly fleaflo are you just reacting like this because of who you feel I am. Or is this reaction to what I said? If I offend you so much please fire me an email and explain what I've done. I've been noticing this tension for a long time but in person you always seem very friendly. Have I personally wronged you?
  10. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    how about this one?
  11. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    ditto, there is middle ground between telling someone what to do and washing your hands of someone's problems that are a result of your actions.

    in manitoba (i think) there was a native community of about 5,000 people, and they had a bunch of suicides in one year so they asked the province's medical examiner to hold an inquest. while he was deciding whether or not to do so, there were 2 more suicides. then he was like 'sorry guys, we're not doing it'.

    so your happy little thought that the canadian and provincial governments are doing all they can to address past wrongs is basically a pile of poo.
  12. Cheeka

    Cheeka TRIBE Member

    exactly Subsonic!

    I took a course at uni about Native rights.
    It was really eye opening and changed my opinion on a lot of these issues.

    I think the question "what more do they want" is pretty short sighted.
    These are things that are rightfully theirs - as dictated on recond - and they are still not even getting half of what they should have.

    They have been and still are very repressed people. There is going to be reprecussions as a result of that.

    Respect I think is the first step.
  13. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    do you guys know that there were residential schools in canada up until 1969?


    this is not ancient history here!

    the anglican church only got around to apologizing in 1993!
  14. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    Well, I was referring to Regent Park and some of it's similarities with Reserves. In that they are government controlled housing communities. They have little to know commerce, which isn't healthy. Physically, they are constructed into vast open spaces. Regent is vast in that there are large parks and open spaces, that are privy to crime at night.

    History has taught that where people thought Regent would be a beneficial project it is not. And all the things that project planners thought would be good, turned out to be the demise of the project. Now the government and the residents are stuck trying to remedy the situaion. But because the population is mostly isolated into a specific demographic, they lack resources to alter that state.

    It's kinda the same thing with the natives on the reserves.

  15. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    either i'm totally thick or you're not making any sense.

    regent park, a housing project in an urban centre, is nothing like a reserve, which is a self-governing rural community.
  16. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    This is true. But the community dynamics are very similar. Closed communities tend to look within, before they look outside. They rely on themselves and interact with each other first. Although geographically there are many differences, and I'm not saying they are the same in all ways.

    But that was my point about that. Does that make sense?

  17. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    how do you know the community dynamics are similar?

  18. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    I kinda described how the communities are similar here...

    You want me to talk about how that makes the people similar?
  19. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    how is a reserve a government controlled housing community?
  20. Subsonic Chronic

    Subsonic Chronic TRIBE Member

    All this talk about what Natives want and what has been given to them isn't addressing the problem that this thread was started about: racism towards natives.

    It is a real problem, and in my opinion, not given the attention it needs considering that it is much more commonplace and much more accepted than racism towards any other group in Canada.

    The only thing that can change this is a change in attitude in the government, in the police, and in the people of Canada. A good start would be for some recognition that this is going on, and the realisation that this is infact racism and not some happy little piece of Canadian culture that we put up with for shits and giggles.

    Obviously we still have politicians and police who don't put the same value on the life of a Native Canadian as they do on the lives of other citizens. When there's public outcry for stupid remarks made by Jim Flaherty, it is at least bringing the situation to light, but we still have a long way to go.

    The fact that cops are STILL using the night drive tactics in some parts of Canada is disgusting and should be treated as a race-based crime, not as a slightly frowned upon means of policing.

  21. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    Ultimately, it is government owned land and ultimately, the government has control over it, they can take it back. Even if the residents do have the power over daily life. It's that element of control that the Guv. still exercises.

  22. Ditto Much

    Ditto Much TRIBE Member



    It was the atitude that it was government land that started the whole problem in the first place. Native land is not under the same administation as the rest of the country. They have there own authority and they have there own justice, education and social policy.
  23. matty

    matty TRIBE Member

    You just asked me what they want and I provided a few examples and no solutions. Sure the time machine hasn't been invented yet but that doesn't mean we should ignore the past, if anything we should work harder in the present since the 'go back in time and fix everything' solution isn't going to happen.

    It's true you can't make anyone respect anyone else but that doesn't mean you can't try. You might be surprised at the influence even one voice can have over other people.

    What is this industry that Native Americans control? The one hotel/bar (i.e. the only business of any kind save the general store) in Nain is run by a german. The nickel deposits close by are on Native land but controlled my multinational mining interests. i don't know the facts for other communities but I don't see why things should be much different anyplace else. How about I stick you in Northern Ontario give you a shack and $600 a month and see what kind of industry you achieve.

    You are right, all we can offer is our assistance and our support. Problem is that most of us can't remember the last time they helped out on a reserve, or in a shelter. Everyone thinks that the government will just clean up the problem and paying our taxes is more than enough contribution. It isn't.
  24. mingster

    mingster TRIBE Member

    Allright, I'm agreeing that the natives control their own land, and what have you, which, by the way, I also think is a problem.

    But I can assure you that the administration is also done in part by the government. And the welfare of the community members as well.

    Even if there wasn't any government interferrence, I don't think that would be any better. (See my argument on outside support, influence and isolated communities).

  25. janiecakes

    janiecakes TRIBE Member

    i believe 'native land' is still legally crown land.

    i'm not 100% sure though.

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