quitting things

Discussion in 'TRIBE Main Forum' started by deep, Jan 19, 2002.

  1. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    I've stopped smoking, atleast for this past week after having bought a pack every other day for the past 6-8 months. I don't claim to have had as difficult a time with this as people who have been smoking for much longer, but thought I would share some of my thoughts on the subject, since quitting things (smoking, drinking, etc.) seems to be a recurring theme here.

    I think that most of the time when people want to quit something it's because they're unsatisfied with the balance point they've reached with whatever it is they're doing. So much so that cutting it out completely seems like the only thing that would restore balance.

    Problem is I don't think this is realistically feasible in most situations. It takes time to acquire a habit of doing things, it takes time to get rid of that habit. The habit was probably acquired gradually, and in turn will need to be removed gradually.

    For things like nicotine there is the quesiton of physiological addiction, that your body chemically becomes dependant on something, and it's not just a question of your willpower. But people make the mistake of thinking it is nonetheless. In situations like this, it's all the more important to gives affordances to the physiological attribution of the problem and not just see things as being 100% within the control of your mind. For things like alcohol, I would there is often a strong psychological association between being drunk as allowing you to have a good time or relax. Getting rid of inaccurate associations like that are best done gradually instead of by fire.

    Unfortunately I don't think most people try to take a gradual approach to things, thinking in all or nothing terms and consequently heightening the risk of their efforts failing.

    It seems that people have the most problem or relapses into the behaviour they're trying to cessate when they put their efforts in black and white terms of failure or success. If they have a cigarette or a drink, they've completely failed, so they might as well fall right off the wagon instead of viewing that one transgression as being an acceptable part of the process. Having a drink when in the company of people who are drinking does not necessarily mean you've fucked up and might as well go on a bender, having a cigarette when out doesn't mean having to chain smoke through a pack. You may just need to find a better balance point at which the negatives don't overwhelm any positives you might derive. For some people that means having nothing at all, for others it may be different.

    For me it helped to rationalize that I wasn't getting anything positive out of what I was doing, and I think it's important to ask yourself why it is you are doing what you do, why you do it to the extent you do, and whether that's what you want. For me, it had become something of a behavioural association more than a need, that merely being bored made me inclined to go light up a cigarette because it was something to do. But afterwards I felt tired, getting your teeth stained yellow or fingers cured like a christmas ham didn't help either. Everytime I would normally go for a cigarette I'd just remind myself of these things and the reason why I seemed to smoke and the feeling would pass. The weirdest part is the first couple days but after you build up some momentum it's like a hitting streak - you don't want to stop once you're doing good and have found a more comfortable balance point.
     
  2. Plato

    Plato TRIBE Member

    ood luck with that deep, its for the better.

    p[l]a+0 <--always finds it so intriguing that such smart people continue to smoke
     
  3. Fir3start3r

    Fir3start3r TRIBE Member

    Good luck man!
    It's for the greater good. [​IMG]
    You're right about people quitting things.
    The best solution is to have a something you're shooting for; what results do you want?
    Have a goal for when times get rough. If you don't have a roadmap from point 'A' to point 'B' you probably won't like where you end up and (more likely than not) probably land up exactly where you started.
    It becomes easy to placate your guilt at this point by just saying, "Screw it, I never really started anyways..."
    Sooner or later we all have to eat at our own banquet of consequences.
     
  4. Bumbaclat

    Bumbaclat TRIBE Member

    well said Deep. The only disagreement I have is that some people need a period of abstinence before they can go back to a balanced lifestyle. Quitting temporarily is much different than quitting permanently. Much easier to rap your head around.

    Bumbaclat
     
  5. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    Nobody likes a quitter.
     
  6. Rosey

    Rosey TRIBE Member

    thanks deep. that was exactly what i needed to hear today. [​IMG]
     
  7. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    cheers ross, hope your efforts are working out.
     
  8. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    "Cheers" is usually said before hoisting a delicious frosty pint.

    Bad choice of words, methinks [​IMG]
     
  9. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    Intelligence doesn't mean intelligent choices 100% of the time. Though it might mean you'll make the choice faster [​IMG]
     
  10. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    for you perhaps [​IMG] I never said I was quitting drinking

    And besides, cheers is used interchangeably by some cultures as a thank you or agreement

    including the culture of deep
     
  11. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    Intelligence with what people do. Intelligence is an engine, to which end it is directed is usually pretty arbitrary. A case can be made for anything. It could be argued that even with neuroprotective measures consuming MDMA is detrimental to ones neurochemical functioning, just as it could be argued that the state of consciousness induced by it is worth the damage.
     
  12. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    corrected
     
  13. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    [​IMG]
     
  14. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    [​IMG]
     
  15. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    You've come a long way since that Petri dish, at yeast I think so.
     
  16. air-bag

    air-bag TRIBE Member

    Definition of intelligene is the ability to comprehend. Therefore an intelligent person would be more potent in comprehending the effects of his addiction and the best way to avoid it. Whether he follows his decisions or not is another thing and called will power.
     
  17. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    Intelligence is nebulous term for an attribute that is composed of many different qualities, there is no unified simple definition. Comprehension of a situation is just one aspect of intelligence.

    Whether threatening factors are personally acknowledged is more dependant on what the person values. People have different belief systems, and as such what is deemed good and bad is more dependant on that than their reason or will power.
     
  18. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    intelligence:

    1) The capacity to acquire and apply knowledge.
    2) The faculty of thought and reason.
    3) Superior powers of mind.

    If one acquires false knowledge, the application of the knowledge will be false. For instance, look at a lot of laws (e.g. marijuana, and other drug laws)... based in false information, when it comes to the application of the "knowledge", the laws are fucked... and I would like to think (though I doubt more and more) that laws are made by intelligent people...

    Also, it doesn't take but a modicum of intelligence to realize that sucking smoke into your lungs isn't good for you.
     
  19. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    Implication : someone who smokes is not not intelligent.

    Flawed fundamental assumptions to this proposition : That behaviour is determined solely by reasoning, in a vacuum devoid of other influences i.e. emotion. That each person has the same value system upon which reasoning takes place, or one person's subjective values is better than anothers.

    Conclusions : You cannot judge a person's intelligence without matching first taking place in the value system upon which their reasoning is based.

    Furthermore if the argument is that since it is well known that smoking is self destructive and that anyone who smokes is stupid for engaging in such behaviour, there are countless examples of self destructive behaviours that people engage in every day of their lives but is ignored. It could be argued that self destruction is within our nature, that we are all stupid in comparison to someone else, and such efforts are myopic, self aggrandizing or an exercise in uselessness. In other words, unintelligent [​IMG]
     
  20. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    I don't get it.
     
  21. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    where am I
     
  22. PosTMOd

    PosTMOd Well-Known Member

    Allison says that after pulling the blankets over her head, and it makes me laugh every time even though I know where she is (I figured it out after the 3rd time).
     
  23. Aphrodite

    Aphrodite TRIBE Member

    Marcia does that.. except I have to pretend to look for her.
     
  24. deep

    deep TRIBE Member

    I'm surprised she leaves herself open to a dutch ovening like that

    I mean it IS you after all
     
  25. Fir3start3r

    Fir3start3r TRIBE Member

    So...we're all ignorant/naive of each others' stupidities? [​IMG]
     

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