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The Flu Shot... Dont Get It!!!!

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Old 10-23-2009, 02:49 PM   #176
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Okay not so much just kidding around anymore

I am going to get the vaccine. I'm sure I put worse shit into my body on any given weekend. I don't care.

But considering you have such faith in this vaccine tell me, considering it's still being tested by Health Canada, what gives you such confidence in this vaccine if it's not purely faith? Seeing as you're such a stickler for the details. I'm curious.

Lys: I'm flattered that in the Tribe world I get singled out for being unreasonable.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:50 PM   #177
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Originally Posted by praktik View Post
Hehe thanks well I've slipped now and then last few days and my vocab makes me seem all high-horsed.

I remember in my days in the call center, when I was running out of patience after years manning the phones...

realizing that there were a string of recent customers who all told me I was being condescending.

I gotta trim down the wordiness sometimes I guess...

Boss Hog is alright my initial annoyance and antagonism has been replaced by a jocular amusement.

(shit, there I go again)

what is "jocular" too big a word to be used now? a woman in my writing group thanked me last night for using the word "conflate" in conversation. so depressing.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:51 PM   #178
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I hope I don't get the flu this year because I heard there is a pretty bad strain going around. I think I will have my Doctor give me a flu shot.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:53 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by Boss Hog View Post
Okay not so much just kidding around anymore

I am going to get the vaccine. I'm sure I put worse shit into my body on any given weekend. I don't care.

But considering you have such faith in this vaccine tell me, considering it's still being tested by Health Canada, what gives you such confidence in this vaccine if it's not purely faith? Seeing as you're such a stickler for the details. I'm curious.

Lys: I'm flattered that in the Tribe world I get singled out for being unreasonable.
who said anything about being singled out? there are lots of unreasonable people on tribe and in the world at large.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:54 PM   #180
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I don't get the regular flu shot due to the mercury content. I've put enough mercury in my body that is too much already.

I am considering this H1N1 shot depending on how things pan out and how safe it turns out to be.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:55 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by Lysistrata View Post
what is "jocular" too big a word to be used now? a woman in my writing group thanked me last night for using the word "conflate" in conversation. so depressing.
I have surely been guilty of being a wordy blowhard at times, but I think there is merit in using plain language and stripping down ones vocabulary for clearer communication.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:57 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by Lysistrata View Post
who said anything about being singled out? there are lots of unreasonable people on tribe and in the world at large.
I only said that because it's been floated around a couple of times lately. There was a time I took debate on the internet seriously, but not any more.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:58 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by Boss Hog View Post
where's the hard data you have on this vaccine again? That's more refined than anything you'll ever post.
Some of my sources (not exhaustive):

NeuroLogica Blog H1N1 Vaccine and GBS

I ended up finding the actual patent Baxter International applied for a vaccine development process which was characterized by the loony tunes crew as "proof it was bio-engineered" since, GASP, it was applied for 1 year before H1N1 came out.

Some data on vitamin D and its degree of helpfulness in preventing flu

Science-Based Medicine Swine Flu Vaccine Fearmongering

Science-Based Medicine An Influenza Primer :
Why then are we so confident that the 2009 (H1N1) strain will behave differently and pose a real risk? Three reasons:

First, recall that the 2009 (H1N1) is distinct from the seasonal A (H1N1). It appears to be a “triple recombination,” with characteristics derived from human, bird, and swine influenzas. When our population was tested for antibodies against 2009 (H1N1) nearly no children, and less than 10% of those under the age of 65 had reactive antibodies, and of those over 65 only 33% showed any response. It seems no one has seen a similar influenza in half a century. This means that the vast majority of our population is susceptible to infection this season; you can see the potential for infection on a grand scale.

Second, unlike the 1976 strain, the 2009 (H1N1) has already proven itself to be highly contagious. From its first appearance in Mexico on March 18th, 2009, it took 4 weeks to spread outside the borders of Mexico, and within 2 more weeks it was in 5 states and 8 other nations. Only 6 weeks after being first identified, over 3000 cases were to be found in 43 states and 23 countries, and on June 11th, 2009, after only 3 months, it had achieved pandemic status. Furthermore, it was able to accomplish all this during the season least conducive to its normal spread.

Finally, the 2009 (H1N1) has proven itself to be far from benign. As of August 22nd, the US has hospitalized 8,843 people with 2009 (H1N1), and 556 have died, 101 of them under the age of 24. We have a hospitalization rate of 4.5/100,000 for ages 0-4, and 2.1/100,000 for ages 5-24. All of this, recall, has happened during influenza’s off-season.

In areas where 2009 (H1N1) emerged during the traditional influenza season, like Australia, they have reported more than a doubling in the number of people hospitalized from influenza, with around 1 in 5 requiring ICU-level care. Similar to what we have seen in the US, Australia has likewise demonstrated that 2009 (H1N1) has a higher attack rate in younger people, which is in stark contrast to the normal seasonal influenza pattern, and has shifted its mean age of death from influenza from 83 down to 54. Unlike what we have seen thus far, Australia has had a much higher hospitalization rate of 34.6/100,000 in ages 0-4, and an overall rate of 12/100,000 for the population. This likely reflects the differences between being on-season and off-season.

That is what makes 2009 (H1N1) so concerning. It is capable of causing serious infections even and perhaps especially in the young and the healthy. It is highly contagious, it has a worldwide population without immunity, and it now exists in low levels in most communities around the nation. And we are now entering into its prime season.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:59 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by Spinsah View Post
I have surely been guilty of being a wordy blowhard at times, but I think there is merit in using plain language and stripping down ones vocabulary for clearer communication.
depends on the context: anything for public/broad consumption has to be in simple language due to people with learning/developmental disabiltiies or who are ESL. but you can't write an academic paper without using a 10 dollar word or 2. and then there's everything in between.
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Old 10-23-2009, 02:59 PM   #185
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I don't even need to read that to have faith in it. I'm getting my shot. thanks for the answer.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:02 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by Maui View Post
I don't get the regular flu shot due to the mercury content. I've put enough mercury in my body that is too much already.

I am considering this H1N1 shot depending on how things pan out and how safe it turns out to be.
Toxicity is determined by the amount you're getting.

The amount of mercury is what's important:
And while we are on the topic of influenza vaccine and thimerosal, the single-dose syringes have no thimerosal. Only the multi-dose vials contain any thimerosal, with each dose containing 25 micrograms of ethylmercury. This 3.5 times less than what you would get from eating a single can of tuna (~87 mcg), is a form of mercury far more rapidly cleared than most environmental mercury exposures (methylmercury), and has been exonerated from suspicion as a cause of autism.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:12 PM   #187
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Yeah, I don't eat fish either.

But yeah thanks for the stats on the flu. I'm the one who originally started the swine flu hysteria last year but I stopped following it in the news.
Definitely gonna get the N1N1 shot.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:15 PM   #188
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NeuroLogica Blog H1N1 Vaccine and GBS

"...but over the last 30 years since the 1976 episode the risk of GBS has been steady at about 1 in a million – far less than the risk of the flu itself."

see the only problem i have with this statement is i'd rather take my increased chances in getting the flu (from which i will most likely recover), than my decreased chances of getting GBS (which i will most likely not recover).

also, while the vaccines are not exclusivley different, it's only just being tested on the h1n1 strain.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:22 PM   #189
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NeuroLogica Blog H1N1 Vaccine and GBS

"...but over the last 30 years since the 1976 episode the risk of GBS has been steady at about 1 in a million – far less than the risk of the flu itself."

see the only problem i have with this statement is i'd rather take my increased chances in getting the flu (from which i will most likely recover), than my decreased chances of getting GBS (which i will most likely not recover).

also, while the vaccines are not exclusivley different, it's only just being tested on the h1n1 strain.
Actually GBS is highly treatable if caught right away. In this current environment I would expect any cases to be treated early since they're all on the lookout. The danger is misdiagnosis or delay of treatment, which could very well incur lifelong, debilitating damage.

The real issue is the correlation/causation debate. Since there is a natural incidence of GBS - if we give out 4 million doses of vaccine and 4 people develop GBS naturally - was the trigger the vaccine - or was it something that was going to be triggered anyway?

Does this vaccine carry the same risks as the one in the 70s when it comes to GBS? So far the data seems to point to no.

Last edited by praktik; 10-23-2009 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:24 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by AgentSanchez View Post
Have any of you seen any hard data that suggests the H1N1 vaccine is effective?
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Originally Posted by Subsonic Chronic View Post
Also... this vaccine is basically the same vaccine we've been using for many years, just with a different strain of flu in it. I don't know why this one is being feared so much more than the regular flu shot... as far as I know it's all the same technology and delivery system so there's no reason why this would be more dangerous.
Attention conscious objectors to flu vaccination:

Please do your research.

The H1N1 vaccine is (thank you SC), being manufactured in the same manner as previous years' seasonal flu vaccine. As H1N1 is predicted to be our seasonal flu virus, no more magic has to go into the preparation process in order to garner it's efficacy. We go through this EVERY year with the newly produced vaccines, establishing their efficacy against a predicated viral entity. Usually it coincides with roll out the vaccine, this year the wave came early so we are lucky to actually have hard core clinical trials.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:25 PM   #191
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Sorry, natural incidence of GBS is about 1 or 2 people per 100 000. Which is higher than I thought - and makes it difficult to tell what caused what if we're talking about a GBS vs vaccine relationship.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:26 PM   #192
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having a doctor on tribe is great.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:28 PM   #193
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isn't it?

Is persephone a doctor too?

She's got some good info comin as well that seems to point to some professional expertise.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:33 PM   #194
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Originally Posted by Lysistrata View Post
A woman in my writing group thanked me last night for using the word "conflate" in conversation. so depressing.
Indeed!
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:35 PM   #195
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:35 PM   #196
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Indeed!
you're making fun of me somehow but i don't get it. i hate that.
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:48 PM   #197
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Btw Cavin who used to work for
Cavin? Is this the same guy who calls himself Crazy Cavin?
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:50 PM   #198
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you're making fun of me somehow but i don't get it. i hate that.
Don't assume the worse. I was agreeing with you. I rock the conflation as well and don't find it that "out there"...
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Old 10-23-2009, 03:58 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by the Doctor View Post
Attention conscious objectors to flu vaccination:

Please do your research.

The H1N1 vaccine is (thank you SC), being manufactured in the same manner as previous years' seasonal flu vaccine. As H1N1 is predicted to be our seasonal flu virus, no more magic has to go into the preparation process in order to garner it's efficacy. We go through this EVERY year with the newly produced vaccines, establishing their efficacy against a predicated viral entity. Usually it coincides with roll out the vaccine, this year the wave came early so we are lucky to actually have hard core clinical trials.
yes, but it's h1n1 that's different. are there results from these clinical trials? everything i'm reading indicates that other than a few countries that just completed interim trials, trails are still on-going, and the vaccine is being rolled out.

did you read the article i posted on the research into the 1918 pandemic and how some epidemologists suggest letting the first wave pass without inocluation. i'm curious as to your opionion.

i should add, i'm not suggesting that nobody get the vaccine, i'm just skeptical as to it's effectiveness based on the information that's out there is all.
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Old 10-23-2009, 04:06 PM   #200
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I reckon she's just got a shot of Flava!



I know I am a monster for posting this I am still laughing
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